Israel is deeply humiliated by Erdogan at Davos

[raminio05]

Originally Posted by IranZamin

Then again, your whole motive here as a good little "Pasha" is to blindly defend anything related to Turkey, as you feel you're obligated by your Azeri ancestry.

To be honest this is the part that i'm most confused about.

[The_Referee]

Originally Posted by Behrooz_C

Do they realise that most of them are ancestrally Greek?

In fact, it is the other way around. Human migration flow was the most effective in changing the genetic makeup before 10,000 years ago due to fact that Europe and most of Earth were sparsely populated then. After then, conquerers or migratory clans could only melt into indigenous people of the places they went to. However, conquerer were very effective in changing cultures, language and religions through elite domination process.

[IranZamin]

Originally Posted by raminio05

To be honest this is the part that i'm most confused about.

I'm not sure what's confusing about it. I have more than a few Azeris in my extended family, and it's no secret that some Azeris feel a certain kinship with Turkey due to linguistic/ethnic ties, which is perfectly understandable. But in some cases this translates into the kind of unconditional support and blind rationalizations we've seen in this thread.

[rahim]

آقا دیروز
شنفتم که گرچه آمرین قتل عم ارامنه از ارتشیان عثمانی بوده اند ، ولی*** عاملین اکثرا از اکراد بودند.
سرزمین تخلیه شده از ارامنه هم تا به امروز عمدتا کرد نشین هستن.
سردمداران ارتش عثمانی هم میتوانستند منتخبی باشند از سران ارتشی ممالک اسلامی تحت حکومت عثمانی.چنانکه ارتش قیزیلباش صفوی مدتی*** بعد از تشکیل، دیگر فقط شامل سرداران قبأل ترک دشت مغان نبود و اکراد یا الوار دوستدار شاه صفوی خود را قیزیلباش میخاندند.
من به این قضیه قتل عام ارامنه ، بیشتر از دید تعصب مذهبی*** اسلامی و احساس خطر امنیتی برای امپراتوری اسلامی عثمانی نگاه می***کنم تا یک حکایت ناسیونالیستی تورکی.
نظر شما چیست؟

[rahim]

یک نکته فقط برای تحریک افکار:
اگر دولت تورکیه بابت فاجعه قتل عام ارامنه توسط خلافت اسلامی عثمانی موظف به پوزش و دادگری است، آیا جمهرری اسلامی ایران هم موظف به چنین پوزش و داد بخشی به سکنهٔ گرجستان بابت قتل عام آقا محمد خواجه قاجار و یا مردم هندوستان بابت قتل عام نادر شاه می***باشد؟

[IranZamin]

Rahim jan, apology pishkesh, they're not even willing to admit it happened! That's the central issue.

I don't think Iranians ever denied Nader Shah's crimes against the Indians. And as far as IR, hypocrisy is the essence of their existence, and we don't have to go that far back to prove it; the mass execution of political prisoners in 88 by itself makes this regime devoid of any moral authority versus Israel.

[The_Referee]

Originally Posted by raminio05

To be honest this is the part that i'm most confused about.

Ramin Jaan,

There is nothing confusing about what IZ has said.
It is called egoistic IZ style posts, trying to divert the actual point when he is short of reason, that is almost alway...

[IranZamin]

oon ke be ma naride bood....

[raminio05]

Originally Posted by IranZamin

I'm not sure what's confusing about it. I have more than a few Azeris in my extended family, and it's no secret that some Azeris feel a certain kinship with Turkey due to linguistic/ethnic ties, which is perfectly understandable. But in some cases this translates into the kind of unconditional support and blind rationalizations we've seen in this thread.

Well, this is why it's surprising and confusing to me. Out of all of my Azeri family (both nuclear and extended), friends, and aquiantances, I have never met one that felt some kind of kinship to Turkey.

[raminio05]

and why are we talking about past Turkish crimes now. this thread is about Israel.

[IranZamin]

Originally Posted by raminio05

Well, this is why it's surprising and confusing to me. Out of all of my Azeri family (both nuclear and extended), friends, and aquiantances, I have never met one that felt some kind of kinship to Turkey.

Come on aziz! I have cousins named Solmaaz and Yashar. I am related to Azeris through marriage and I know for a fact there are some Azeris who consider themselves Iranian but also identify on some level with Turkey, which as I said before, is perfectly normal and understandable, unless it turns into fanaticism and bias.

And for the record, this turned into a "Turkey discussion" because someone jumped in and accused others of ignorance for merely pointing out a historical fact. A fact that was worth mentioning given the country represented by Mr.Erdogan. I hope this is my last word.

[deerouz]

جناب رحیم خان عزیز
فرمایش شما صحیح است، قتل عام و غارت ارامنه در عمل توسط قبایل کرد انجام شد ولی تنها پس از آن که عثمانیان ارامنه را اسیر و اخراج کردند (به سمت سوریه) و اموال آنان را مصادره نمودند بیشتر ارامنه وادار شدند تا پای پیاده مسیر طولانی تا سوریه را طی کنند و در طول این مسیر اکثر اخراج شدگان بدست کردها کشته شده و یا از گرسنگی و بیماری درگذشتند.

نکته شما در خصوص انگیزه عمل هم صحیح است. واقعیت این است که در آن مقطع زمانی ارامنه و آسوریان ایران و ترکیه از طرف روسیه تشویق و حمایت می شدند تا کشور مستقلی در محدوده آذربایجان غربی ایران، شرق ترکیه و ارمنستان ایجاد نمایند. در ایران نیز با هدایت چند تن میسیونر اوانجلیست آمریکائی، گروههای تندرو آسوری و ارمنی مسلح شده و شهر ارومیه را به کنترل درآوردند و به روایت احمد کسروی (در تاریخ هجده ساله آذربایجان) بیش از500 تن را بقتل رسانیدند تا اینکه جنبش آنان توسط رهبر محلی کرد (اسماعیل آقا سمیتقو) سرکوب شد. از دیدگاه عثمانیان، ارمنی ها همدست روسها در میانه جنگی خونین بودند و سرکوب آنان بخشی از استراتژی جنگی علیه روسیه تلقی می شد. ولی بهرحال انگیزه عمل هرچه باشد در ماهیت جنایتکارانه آن که قتل عام افراد بیگناه غیرنظامی است تغییری حاصل نمی کند.
با سپاس. .

[PashaBahman]

Originally Posted by IranZamin

And after those few attempts you still haven't managed to grasp the fact that 1)no one claimed what your suggesting, 2)that difference is not quite as clear-cut as you desperately want to believe and 3)even if it was, it would be completely irrelevant to the issue, as demonstrated by my example of the Germans.

Drivel, your example proved my point, two different governments.

I don't need to "guess" their feelings. They make them clear when they go apeshit every time someone mentions the truth inside or outside of Turkey. Then again, your whole motive here as a good little "Pasha" is to blindly defend anything related to Turkey, as you feel you're obligated by your Azeri ancestry.

This is a perfect example of how bias and blind prejudice make it impossible to offer a reasonable argument, especially when that bias is mixed with the knee-jerk sentimentality of adolescence.

I am not defending them, them being the Ottoman Empire, not the Turkish Republic, that's the point, you can grasp something that simple.

I am not Azeri or Turk, I like the title Pasha. Turks have done plenty wrong, you're just desperately trying to come out on top as if this is a competition and it's not working.

[The_Referee]

Originally Posted by IranZamin

oon ke be ma naride bood....

خود گوئي و خود خندي - عجب مرد؟؟؟ هنرمندي؟!

Again, another great example of your pleased by self attitude and your way of unreasoning.

[deerouz]

Originally Posted by raminio05

and why are we talking about past Turkish crimes now. this thread is about Israel.

Well this is a piece of news about Turkey and Israel.