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byebyenow, aziz, im sorry but you are dead wrong, all of Italy's game winning goals came from Baggio, Nigeria, Spain and Bulgaria mostly by individual brilliance. It wasnt even comparable with Brazil, who had both Bebeto and Romario (both forwards) doing the scoring. If there ever was a player who carried a team, It was R.Baggio in 94. Of course they had quality players, they made it to the final, but it was the Baggio show after the group stages.
and in the final, Brazil was clearly the better team with a lot more scoring chances. I was rooting for Italy in that one, but Brazil was the better team, They had Dunga, Jorginho, Marcio Santos, Bebeto.
and in the final, Brazil was clearly the better team with a lot more scoring chances. I was rooting for Italy in that one, but Brazil was the better team, They had Dunga, Jorginho, Marcio Santos, Bebeto.
Well, I don't really agree with you. back in the WC94, Italy had great individuals but they didn't play well at all. Baggio single handedly took them to the final. Brazil's star of the show was Romario but not only they had other great individuals like Dunga, Cafu, Branco, Marcio Santos, Tafarell, etc but also they played great as a team (I don't mean attractive, but they played great tactically).
Italy is my favorite national team after Iran and Brazil but to be honest, IMO THAT Italy didn't even deserve to be in the final when both Holland and Sweden, played so much better football.
Italy is my favorite national team after Iran and Brazil but to be honest, IMO THAT Italy didn't even deserve to be in the final when both Holland and Sweden, played so much better football.
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in WC94, Bebeto was definately the star of the Brazilian team for me...Romario got much more credit & attention for his goals...
On a slightly unrelated note, damn you Vogts for screwing up one of the best German NT ever!!!
Lothar, Moeller, Klinsi, Haessler, Helmer, Kohler, Voeller, Effenberg, Sammer, Illgner...
On a slightly unrelated note, damn you Vogts for screwing up one of the best German NT ever!!!
Lothar, Moeller, Klinsi, Haessler, Helmer, Kohler, Voeller, Effenberg, Sammer, Illgner...
Bebeto...
oh please..
Was Bebeto anything before or after 94??
Bebeto...
one of best ever??
just looking at the players you mentioned:
past his very best, overrated throughout his life, very good, agreed, tad overrated, what??, good player, past his best, idiot, before his best..
best german team ever?? 1972.....and maybe 2010.
oh please..
Was Bebeto anything before or after 94??
Bebeto...
one of best ever??
just looking at the players you mentioned:
past his very best, overrated throughout his life, very good, agreed, tad overrated, what??, good player, past his best, idiot, before his best..
best german team ever?? 1972.....and maybe 2010.
Bebeto...
oh please..
Was Bebeto anything before or after 94??
Bebeto...
one of best ever??
just looking at the players you mentioned:
past his very best, overrated throughout his life, very good, agreed, tad overrated, what??, good player, past his best, idiot, before his best..
best german team ever?? 1972.....and maybe 2010.
oh please..
Was Bebeto anything before or after 94??
Bebeto...
one of best ever??
just looking at the players you mentioned:
past his very best, overrated throughout his life, very good, agreed, tad overrated, what??, good player, past his best, idiot, before his best..
best german team ever?? 1972.....and maybe 2010.
I dunno about before...but in USA94...Bebeto was the reason Brazil did so well...
Again Im not a Brazil fan...nor a Bebeto fan...
Just what I thought about that team in 1994...
Regarding your comments on the German team...u do realize that its YOUR opinion!! right?
NOT A FACT!!
Did I say WC94 German NT was THE BEST? nope!
I said ONE OF THE BEST...and it truely was...
The combination of the WC90 team plus the new blood...nearly perfect!!
Its amazing how every single Borussia Dortmund player is either an idiot or very overrated, in your opinion!!
ps, Andi Moeller = a midfield GOD!!!
Brazil in 94, if it was anyone, was Romario. Bebeto was nothing that great. If anything, he looked much better than he actually was next to Romario. The reason Brazil did well in 94 was having a leader in midfield(Dunga), a semi-professional attitude towards defending, and Romario upfront scoring. Bebeto did his fair share, but please..
The combination of an over the top 90 team, plus new, not so good, blood. I agree, yes.
Effenberg was a Dortmund player? Interesting..
Andi Moeller midfield God?? you are joking, right?? Moeller was the biggest choker in German history.
And funny that you believe that I have ANYTHING against Dortmund. In fact, I would argue that Sammer was the most intelligent player Germany had in the 90ies, but anyway. In 94, he wasn't where he was in 96...that's the whole point.
And also, in 94 Germany didn't have anything you could call a team.
The combination of an over the top 90 team, plus new, not so good, blood. I agree, yes.
Effenberg was a Dortmund player? Interesting..
Andi Moeller midfield God?? you are joking, right?? Moeller was the biggest choker in German history.
And funny that you believe that I have ANYTHING against Dortmund. In fact, I would argue that Sammer was the most intelligent player Germany had in the 90ies, but anyway. In 94, he wasn't where he was in 96...that's the whole point.
And also, in 94 Germany didn't have anything you could call a team.
Your missing my point regarding Bebeto!
Romario got all the glory up front while if it wasn't Bebeto's hard work, Romario wouldn't have shined so much...
Not so good blood? can you name them please!
The emergance of "relatively new" stars Andi Moeller, Mathias Sammer, Steffan Effenberg, Thomas Helmer, Mario Basler....combined with the backbone of the 1990 team (Lothar, Klinsi, Illgner, Haessler, Voeller, Brehme, Buchwald...) formed, IN THEORY, an invincible team!!!
When did I say Effenberg was a Dortmund player??
I said you called every sinlge Dortmund player either overrated or idiot!!
Look at the order of how you described the players:
Moeller: overrated throughout his life!
Kohler: what??
Sammer: Idiot!
Was Lothar a BVB player?? no!
Was Klinsmann a BVB player?? no!
Was Illgner a BVB player?? no!
was...
But how many BVB players were on my list that u mocked??
3! (if I'm not mistaking)
Andreas Moeller won the WC in 1990 (though he was very young in that tourny)
He won Euro 1996
He won CL 1997 (BVB)
He won Uefa cup 1993 (JUVE)
Numerous German league & cups with BVB & Schalke
85 caps...30 goals!!
close to 500 club games!!
YUP!! VERY OVERRATED!:--wink:
I can talk aobut his game all night long...but Im really tired now...hopefully tomorrow we shall continue the debate...
TRUE!! just like I said
Because of a certain Berti...
Romario got all the glory up front while if it wasn't Bebeto's hard work, Romario wouldn't have shined so much...
Not so good blood? can you name them please!
The emergance of "relatively new" stars Andi Moeller, Mathias Sammer, Steffan Effenberg, Thomas Helmer, Mario Basler....combined with the backbone of the 1990 team (Lothar, Klinsi, Illgner, Haessler, Voeller, Brehme, Buchwald...) formed, IN THEORY, an invincible team!!!
When did I say Effenberg was a Dortmund player??
I said you called every sinlge Dortmund player either overrated or idiot!!
Look at the order of how you described the players:
Moeller: overrated throughout his life!
Kohler: what??
Sammer: Idiot!
Was Lothar a BVB player?? no!
Was Klinsmann a BVB player?? no!
Was Illgner a BVB player?? no!
was...
But how many BVB players were on my list that u mocked??
3! (if I'm not mistaking)
Andreas Moeller won the WC in 1990 (though he was very young in that tourny)
He won Euro 1996
He won CL 1997 (BVB)
He won Uefa cup 1993 (JUVE)
Numerous German league & cups with BVB & Schalke
85 caps...30 goals!!
close to 500 club games!!
YUP!! VERY OVERRATED!:--wink:
I can talk aobut his game all night long...but Im really tired now...hopefully tomorrow we shall continue the debate...
TRUE!! just like I said
Because of a certain Berti...
Which hard work? He was supposed to be the support striker. Play Ronaldo there, and Brazil would have scored 2 more goals in each game.
Now apart of that, can you point out to ANYTHING bebeto achieved apart of 94 World Cup? Anything? I'm happy with a top scorer title in brazil or a league title in brazil.
Moeller was part of the 90ies team and was supposed to shine there already. he didn't however. Haessler took Germany to the 90 World Cup thanks to his freekick goal against Wales. Völler, Brehme, Buchwald WERE PAST THEIR PRIME. What you say is like anyone claiming Thuram and Desailly were in 2002 better than in 1998.
That team you call was so invincible that they lost to anyone from Netherlands, Wales to Denmark.
Did you read what I wrote above about Sammer? No? Effenberg was the idiot(despite being a good player).
Great...so he had 85 caps. Could you name 5 games from top of your head he played brilliant, against semi-decent opponents though, not Albania and Lithunia.
I can name from top of my head 5 great games by Youri Djorkaeff for France, I challenge you to name 5 from Moeller. The fact is that for the national team, Moeller was a big zero and for the CL in 97, thanks go more to Sammer and Riedle than anyone else. Moeller however, was a choker. That's why they called him "Heintje" in Germany.
Pfft..whatever..good luck.
No, because of too many inflated egos(Matthaeus, Effe, Kohler,Moeller etc.)
Now apart of that, can you point out to ANYTHING bebeto achieved apart of 94 World Cup? Anything? I'm happy with a top scorer title in brazil or a league title in brazil.
Moeller was part of the 90ies team and was supposed to shine there already. he didn't however. Haessler took Germany to the 90 World Cup thanks to his freekick goal against Wales. Völler, Brehme, Buchwald WERE PAST THEIR PRIME. What you say is like anyone claiming Thuram and Desailly were in 2002 better than in 1998.
That team you call was so invincible that they lost to anyone from Netherlands, Wales to Denmark.
Did you read what I wrote above about Sammer? No? Effenberg was the idiot(despite being a good player).
Great...so he had 85 caps. Could you name 5 games from top of your head he played brilliant, against semi-decent opponents though, not Albania and Lithunia.
I can name from top of my head 5 great games by Youri Djorkaeff for France, I challenge you to name 5 from Moeller. The fact is that for the national team, Moeller was a big zero and for the CL in 97, thanks go more to Sammer and Riedle than anyone else. Moeller however, was a choker. That's why they called him "Heintje" in Germany.
Pfft..whatever..good luck.
No, because of too many inflated egos(Matthaeus, Effe, Kohler,Moeller etc.)
Bebeto and Romario made a great duo upfront in the WC94. But I think anyone instead of Bebeto would have made a great duo with Romario. However, I don't think just anyone would have made a good pair with Bebeto.
With all that said, if Bebeto was out of a game because of an injury, I wouldn't worry as much as if Romario was out. Now that would have been a disaster.
With all that said, if Bebeto was out of a game because of an injury, I wouldn't worry as much as if Romario was out. Now that would have been a disaster.