Maradona v Messi

[Sporthead]

I'm a great admirer of Lionel Messi. Not since Maradona have I enjoyed watching someone play as much as I like watching Messi. And in the ensuing period there has been many "great" players. Cantona, Ronaldo (the brazillian one), Rivaldo, Zidane just to name a few....

I know that its unfair to compare players from different eras (even successful ones) but taking emotion out of the equation I still can't go past Maradona as the best player in the last 30 years (if not all time). For all the accolades that Messi has deservedly achieved, for me (and perhaps millions of Argentinians), his failure to replicate his club success at the international scene will always be a blot on his copy book. thankfully he is still young and has the opportunity to set that record straight. It takes a legendary player like Messi, for football fans to just really appreciate what an out of this world player Maradona was! No disrespect to the rest of '86 Argentina squad, but Maradona may aswell have gone into the nearest pub and given national jerseys to the 10 blokes sitting nearest to the door and I still think Argentina would've won the world cup!

Napoli was nowhere before Maradona's entrance, and faded straight after maradona's departure but what an unbelievable seven years he had there! The reason that for me Maradona is the greatest is that if you took him out of the teams he played in those teams would be nowhere! That is the difference!

 

[Mahdi]

football in 2011 is more of a team sports than it was in 86.

that's why in 86 you could win by simply playing 11 very talented players with little tactics but it's impossible to do so in 2011.

Just look at the last 4 tournaments and you will see that the teams that operated best as teams performed the best, not those with the most talent. It's also no conincidence that in Copa America the last 4 teams are all from small nations and except for Uruguay, none of them has much football tradition. Add to that Uruguay plays without Cavani, their best forward.

So no matter how good Messi is, at the end of the day if his manager is a clear bozo and goes for narrow when the field is already narrow like he did against Uruguay instead of adding width, then...he can't do much. Maradona for all his teammates might have lacked, still had a half decent coach.

 

[Pooya]

I dont think its fair to compare them at all since they are from different times. you can compare Messi with CR and we all know who wins there

 

[Khorus]

It is never easy to compare players, especially when played in different eras. I don't agree with Westi in that today's game is more of a teamwork game than it was in 1986. You look at the 1970 Brazil and 1974 Holland, as gifted as the individuals were on those teams, it was their team play above all that made them as great as they were. Both Maradona and Messi were/are very gifted players. They both had very good ball skills and awareness on the pitch, so they are very much the same style players. The only differences I see, is that Maradona was a little strong physically and probably had a little more desire than Messi. The other difference in terms of their achievement was that Maradona had a better supporting cast around him and a little bit of luck when it came to the WC. The striking difference between the 2 players achievement is when Messi plays for Argentina rather than Barcelona. Maradona was great when he played at Napoli and he won the WC with Argentina. Messi has won everything at the club level, but he has done nothing on the national level. There is only one logical answer to that - he doesn't have the same quality on his national team as Maradona did. To a smaller degree and this is just from my observation, Messi doesn't seem have the same level of desire and intensity that Maradona displayed (maybe it was the drugs, but still I just don't see Messi with the same intensity).

 

[Bache Tehroon]

Barcelona is not a club to sustainably tolerate one-man shows like Maradona anymore, neither is Argentina's national team.

Messi never got the green light to pull Maradona's stunts and learn from failed attempts. In today's football, players don't get the chance to fuck up too much. Maradona's brilliance did come at the cost of his teammates getting rendered useless and the team-spirit suffering, not to mention his many many many failed attempts that only made him more experienced in handling failure.

In general, football was more relaxed back then. Now one mistake is shown from 40 different angles with the coach's reaction on your screen's corner. Players can't afford to make mistakes, hence the lack of courage and freedom on the field.

 

[Bache Tehroon]

I also find Messi galaxies humbler than Maradona (for now). They're not even comparable in terms of attitude. Maradona was born a captain. Messi was not.

 

[Payandeh Iran]

Maradona was born a captain. Messi was not.

Bingo

 

[jspworld]

Maradona won the world cup at the age of 26, Messi will be 26 in world cup 2014 so we'll soon find out then!!!

 

[Mahdi]

It is never easy to compare players, especially when played in different eras. I don't agree with Westi in that today's game is more of a teamwork game than it was in 1986. You look at the 1970 Brazil and 1974 Holland, as gifted as the individuals were on those teams, it was their team play above all that made them as great as they were. Both Maradona and Messi were/are very gifted players. They both had very good ball skills and awareness on the pitch, so they are very much the same style players. The only differences I see, is that Maradona was a little strong physically and probably had a little more desire than Messi. The other difference in terms of their achievement was that Maradona had a better supporting cast around him and a little bit of luck when it came to the WC. The striking difference between the 2 players achievement is when Messi plays for Argentina rather than Barcelona. Maradona was great when he played at Napoli and he won the WC with Argentina. Messi has won everything at the club level, but he has done nothing on the national level. There is only one logical answer to that - he doesn't have the same quality on his national team as Maradona did. To a smaller degree and this is just from my observation, Messi doesn't seem have the same level of desire and intensity that Maradona displayed (maybe it was the drugs, but still I just don't see Messi with the same intensity).

What set Holland and Brazil apart in 70 and 74 was that apart of great individual skills they also had a great set of team work and tactical work. Further, with both teams you had blocks of Ajax and Santos players(just as Spain had a block of Barca players)
But look at Germany in 90, Brazil in 94, Italy in 94, Argentina in 86...it was the greater individual skills over team work triumphing.
Further, back in 80ies and 90ies the best football was played at national team tournaments. Now it's played at club level, for the simple fact that players spend more time together, tactics refined etc.

 

[InDaMoneyz]

This is joke of a question! you gotta be out of your mind if you dont see the difference! There is no comparisson, Maradonna hands down !!!! all this BS about soccer being different and therefore players perform differently is ridiculous and simple minded.

If anything soccer as a game was more physical and much tougher at the time maradonna played than any other time in history. Defensive games, defensive leagues (including serie A) and great defenders were the name of the game!

Soccer has changed significantly since the 90s to suit and protect the super stars - becoming virtualy a no touch game stars have been created that would have no chance otherwise in the 90s or 80s. So if anything team or no team - today's stars have much more room to shine than ever before.

All which will tell us how much better maradonna was better than this messi.

In the toughest league in the world - with a good side but not a great side Maradonna single handedly took napoli from nothingness to greatness! performing against the best players and best sides in the world!

Maradonna also as we all know was amazing for a team that had no one else on it - Argentina! he performed for that team with various players over and over when mattered most - at a time when national sides were tougher to play against

Simply put- maradonna was a multidimensional big game player, where as messi is nothing but a one dimensional player and a star against the weak! 1988 maradonna would go to any team dominating any opponent - he could go to England and be the best!

Messi on the other hand can only perform under a certain system, with a certain set of players against a certain set of opponents ! - big big difference

 

[InDaMoneyz]

There is only one logical answer to that - he doesn't have the same quality on his national team as Maradona did. To a smaller degree and this is just from my observation, Messi doesn't seem have the same level of desire and intensity that Maradona displayed (maybe it was the drugs, but still I just don't see Messi with the same intensity).

WHAT !?!?!? sorry dude -but that was the most illogical answer!

my friend in the the last world cup Argentina probably had the most star studed talented side in their history! At no other time has argentina had so much quality on their side! unbelievable talent from across the globe at the highest quality!

what would messi do if he had to play with talentless argentina side of 1990 or even 1986!?

 

[OSTAD POOYA]

Players were much more physical and tough back in the 90’s and 80’s compared to today’s standards. Right now for anything they would hand you a card and some of those cards have been witnessed in the Copa America during the past few weeks. The element of physical play has been taken out to a great degree due to watching over the health of players and also the number of games which are played now compared to then. This is also seen in the Basketball as where the defense of the 80’s and 90’s of the NBA was more tough than today.


Due to the development of the game and physicality of players those playing today are in better (stronger) shape today and their bodies can take on more demands. This has to do with developments in training, medicine, nutrition, and other factors contributed. Also the game is more of a team game now instead of the individual talents of then. Those talents still come around and were last seen in Zidane leading his team to the final of 2006. Messi is very young and can still accomplish this. Looking at the greatest players of all time both national heroics and club level are looked upon. All those greats have proved their skill on both levels and looking at Maradona and what he had he has certainly accomplished more than Messi. Looking at his surrounding players and the victories with his club and at national level it sure does make it seem more impressive. In Messi’s defense he is playing in a situation where teams are much closer to each other and the competition is greatly fierce and his championships in the CL speaks volumes for itself. Simply looking at the conditions of then and now Maradona is more accomplished and has done more but Messi has a good 10 years left and the sky is the limit. When Argentina won back then there were only a handful of great teams, now in this world simply any team can come out and win which makes the competition much much harder.

I simply think each player has to be looked at within his own time frame and competition. Each era presents a different set of challenges and it is within those parameters which you will find greatness.

 

[Messi]

Maradonna? Wow IDM never ceases to crack me up.

 

[ME]

Unless someone has not even remotely seen Maradona play, comparing the two is just totally insane. In the last 20 years so many were poetrated as challengers to Diego form Romario to Rivaldo to Ronaldo...and now Messi. They all fade in the history as some great players but will never be remembered as Diego was. The common illusion is that the man was nothing beyond dribbling and scoring. But, the real Maradona was not who won 1986 mesmerizing the whole world. He was the man who was not able to stop his crying after he was rubbed the 1990 title.

 

[AFRIRAN]

Unless someone has not even remotely seen Maradona play, comparing the two is just totally insane. In the last 20 years so many were poetrated as challengers to Diego form Romario to Rivaldo to Ronaldo...and now Messi. They all fade in the history as some great players but will never be remembered as Diego was. The common illusion is that the man was nothing beyond dribbling and scoring. But, the real Maradona was not who won 1986 mesmerizing the whole world. He was the man who was not able to stop his crying after he was rubbed the 1990 title.

yeh he didn't fade in the history because he is a Drug Dealer Mudefaka Pimp but Messi is just an honest soccer player.

 

[Bache Tehroon]

Unless someone has not even remotely seen Maradona play, comparing the two is just totally insane. In the last 20 years so many were poetrated as challengers to Diego form Romario to Rivaldo to Ronaldo...and now Messi. They all fade in the history as some great players but will never be remembered as Diego was. The common illusion is that the man was nothing beyond dribbling and scoring. But, the real Maradona was not who won 1986 mesmerizing the whole world. He was the man who was not able to stop his crying after he was rubbed the 1990 title.

I don't know if he was rubbed. Germany was as good a football team as it was imaginable in 1990. 10 games between Argentina and Germany would definitely yield a German victor.

 

[OSTAD POOYA]

I don't know if he was rubbed. Germany was as good a football team as it was imaginable in 1990. 10 games between Argentina and Germany would definitely yield a German victor.

The Germans are superior to the Argentine in the WC. Looking at previous meetings from 90 on the Germans have defeated them 3 times in playoffs. The German team that won in 90 was coached by Beckenbaur who had also coached them against Argentina in 86. He is a great coach and the only coach besides Zagallo to win the WC as a player and coach. He was also team captain in 74 when Germany won the WC. That team was under making under him in 90 and played very good football (like the swiss watch that the Germans are!) Maradona had a chance to avenge the defeat of 90 and 06 but failed bad in a crushing loss. Personally I was going for Argentina and Maradona but the Germans were simply more hungry with better tactics.

 

[ME]

I don't know if he was rubbed. Germany was as good a football team as it was imaginable in 1990. 10 games between Argentina and Germany would definitely yield a German victor.

BT Jan, Germany for sure was the strongest 1990 team, but yet Argentina made a signature of paralzing football in what is known as the worst WC ever. After that point, many traditional football rules changed only to keep the game attractive and offensive.
But the story of the final game is different. Keep in mind that per rules up to then, the physical contacts led to penalty and red card aganist Argentina were not supposed to be treated that harshly. That penalty is still a big contraversy.
Here is the clip that actually misses a moment before penalty against Argentina called where Augentaller actually comitted a real penalty against argentina per se.


[video=youtube;Ybj5I44nBnE]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ybj5I44nBnE[/video]

 

[ME]

yeh he didn't fade in the history because he is a Drug Dealer Mudefaka Pimp but Messi is just an honest soccer player.

Maradona drug dealer?
No doubt he was a scumbag personality but he was never a drug dealer or a pimp. He was an addict and had multiple other issues that were disclosed only when he started getting his ass into leftish politics and also when he refused to take care of Italian Mafia. Messi also is no saint, wasn't he the one recently pimping on the internet?
Plus, I thought we were talking football and football reltaed stuff, who cares which one is more of a loser or a winner than the other.

 

[InDaMoneyz]

BT Jan, Germany for sure was the strongest 1990 team, but yet Argentina made a signature of paralzing football in what is known as the worst WC ever. After that point, many traditional football rules changed only to keep the game attractive and offensive.
But the story of the final game is different. Keep in mind that per rules up to then, the physical contacts led to penalty and red card aganist Argentina were not supposed to be treated that harshly. That penalty is still a big contraversy.
Here is the clip that actually misses a moment before penalty against Argentina called where Augentaller actually comitted a real penalty against argentina per se.


[video=youtube;Ybj5I44nBnE]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ybj5I44nBnE[/video]

I'm not sure what you are exactly trying to say, but that red card by today's standards is a given and even back then it would have been a 50-50 call. On germany - I think there is no doubt they were the most complete, dynamic team of that tournament and one of the best of all time! not only did they have incredible quality in every area they also played best soccer as a team !

1990 being the worst - another fallacy, if anything looking back the 1990 world cups should be considered as one of the greatest of all time with some of the greatest, most compelling games ever! in fact it was the last world cup where one witnessed as many classics in a world cup and the last time so many countries fielded one if not their greatest ever sides:
Germany, Italy, Holland, England, Ireland, Soviet, Cameroon (africa), Yugoslavia, Czechoslovakia, Belgium in my opinion to that point fielded their greatest sides ever!

in 1990 you also had the greatest number of classic games and in no world cup in history did one against witness as many incredible matches in playoffs:

Germany-Holland, Germany-Czech, Argentina-Yugo, Brazil-Argentina, Argentina-Italy, England-Cameroon, Germany-England, Italy-Argentina,...just one great classic after another. The problem was that the final wasnt a good match and argentina having 4 players suspended and one red carded in the game were severly handicapped and were big underdogs. In addition Brazil for first time adopted a more european style of soccer where emphasize was on result than style and people hated that. Else 1990 was far superior to 94,98,02 in every aspect 2006 we saw some more quality games but 2010 was another horrible world cup.

In many ways 1990 was the last great world cup where for most parts national sides were still better than club sides. After 90 all changed anyways and WC was no longer the benchmark of greatest soccer being played.