I don't know man, that France midfield was superior to that Brazil midfield, French did controlled the game.
Brazil of 90 had nothing to do with Brazil of 86 like how Brazil 86 had nothing to do with Brazil 82. You could make a case of 82 and 86 being similar since they had the same coach but not 90!
well, unlike you I don't rate the WC as the best element to evaluate players. Schilachi and Suker were also the top goal scorer of WC but they weren't the top top forwards at the time. We shouldn't judge players based on their performance in WC as much since it is such a short tournament. Again Careca was a good goal scorer but wasn't a very complete player, he never really got involved with the game he was just a good finisher. But to consider him hard to replace is not accurate as there were tons of great forwards at the time not only in SerieA but all over Europe.
Careca in WC86 really shone in one match against Northern Ireland when he scored two goals, in other games when he scored he was just at the end of the great services from his teammates (Just like him in Napoli which he scored goals mostly because of Maradona services) or he scored from the penalty spot . There were tons of forwards as good as Careca at the time, I don't believe it would have been hard at all to replace him.
I'm sorry but this is a ridiculous claim, almost every one of them were in good forms in that period, even the young Klinsmann was killing it in Inter in late 80's let alone likes of Van Basten and Vialli.
S. Korea cheated their way to semifinal, there was nothing fantastic about their tournament as they were fantastic in elbowing and punching and cheating. I respect Japan much more than that savage S.Korea. Maybe Spain deserved to be there. Italy had great players but they weren't clicking like they supposed to. However they deserved to beat that Korea but ref messed it up for them.
Anyway the reason France was so special was because of their midfield even if they would have lost to Brazil they would have still been phrased by many people. It was more or less that great French team who won Europe two years before that. Germany had many great top players and Argentina was very special because of Maradona. Brazil was just alright but of course very tough to beat!
It is not Subjective at all, Maradona didn't have half as many superstars and international players around him compared to any of those players you named!
Every time we get to the conclusion but every once in a while you come out and claiming Maradona couldn't have been successful without Careca, lol!
Your problem is not people's exaggeration as there always been exaggeration about Pele and some other players but you are too sensitive about Maradona and Messi cases because they are Argentinian and you don't like them
Brazil of 90 had nothing to do with Brazil of 86 like how Brazil 86 had nothing to do with Brazil 82. You could make a case of 82 and 86 being similar since they had the same coach but not 90!
well, unlike you I don't rate the WC as the best element to evaluate players. Schilachi and Suker were also the top goal scorer of WC but they weren't the top top forwards at the time. We shouldn't judge players based on their performance in WC as much since it is such a short tournament. Again Careca was a good goal scorer but wasn't a very complete player, he never really got involved with the game he was just a good finisher. But to consider him hard to replace is not accurate as there were tons of great forwards at the time not only in SerieA but all over Europe.
Careca in WC86 really shone in one match against Northern Ireland when he scored two goals, in other games when he scored he was just at the end of the great services from his teammates (Just like him in Napoli which he scored goals mostly because of Maradona services) or he scored from the penalty spot . There were tons of forwards as good as Careca at the time, I don't believe it would have been hard at all to replace him.
I'm sorry but this is a ridiculous claim, almost every one of them were in good forms in that period, even the young Klinsmann was killing it in Inter in late 80's let alone likes of Van Basten and Vialli.
S. Korea cheated their way to semifinal, there was nothing fantastic about their tournament as they were fantastic in elbowing and punching and cheating. I respect Japan much more than that savage S.Korea. Maybe Spain deserved to be there. Italy had great players but they weren't clicking like they supposed to. However they deserved to beat that Korea but ref messed it up for them.
Anyway the reason France was so special was because of their midfield even if they would have lost to Brazil they would have still been phrased by many people. It was more or less that great French team who won Europe two years before that. Germany had many great top players and Argentina was very special because of Maradona. Brazil was just alright but of course very tough to beat!
It is not Subjective at all, Maradona didn't have half as many superstars and international players around him compared to any of those players you named!
My main point was directed at Azhidahak who was going on about single handedly this or single handedly that which is a clear exaggeration, created by the media. and we have had this discussion before and we rapped up the discussion with about the same conclusion we are about to make. So knowing that, I don't know why you had to take the same arguments back and force us to write 5 pages of old discussions which I really wanted to avoid?
Your problem is not people's exaggeration as there always been exaggeration about Pele and some other players but you are too sensitive about Maradona and Messi cases because they are Argentinian and you don't like them
Ok, I really don't agree with alot of things you said here, specially about the Brazil of 86 and Careca but I'm on my way to catch a plane so I wont have time to reply. I just have to say:
You have really mistaken about me! I never meant to say Maradona couldn't be successful without Careca. But he too, needed good players (not only average ones as many claim) around him to be successful even though not all of them were stars. and yes Pele is the god of football but that doesn't mean I don't like Maradona or Messi (specially). Maybe I have given a wrong impression with my arguments which is very unfortunate. I'm merely against exaggerations and over the top comments. Maradona to me is the second best player ever existed and Messi.... Messi is indisputably the best player in the world today and he's been for about afew years. He needs more things to reach the very top ones: winning everything there is to win, including WC trophies.
Ciao....
Every time we get to the conclusion but every once in a while you come out and claiming Maradona couldn't have been successful without Careca, lol!
Your problem is not people's exaggeration as there always been exaggeration about Pele and some other players but you are too sensitive about Maradona and Messi cases because they are Argentinian and you don't like them
Your problem is not people's exaggeration as there always been exaggeration about Pele and some other players but you are too sensitive about Maradona and Messi cases because they are Argentinian and you don't like them
I never meant to say Maradona couldn't be successful without Careca. But he too, needed good players (not only average ones as many claim) around him to be successful even though not all of them were stars. and yes Pele is the god of football but that doesn't mean I don't like Maradona or Messi (specially). Maybe I have given a wrong impression with my arguments which is very unfortunate. I'm merely against exaggerations and over the top comments. Maradona to me is the second best player ever existed and Messi.... Messi is indisputably the best player in the world today and he's been for about afew years. He needs more things to reach the very top ones: winning everything there is to win, including WC trophies. Ciao....
It's ok but I don't think you are going to change my opinion about Careca much as there were enough great forwards at the time. Anyway God speed to you!
That is fair enough but seems like you are much more sensitive about exaggeration over Argentinian than Brazilians. And I don't agree with you that Messi needs to win WC to prove himself. He has already proven himself, and other great players such as Platini, Cruyff, Baggio and ect.. never won the WC and still are considered to be one of the greatest footballers.
You have really mistaken about me! I never meant to say Maradona couldn't be successful without Careca. But he too, needed good players (not only average ones as many claim) around him to be successful even though not all of them were stars. and yes Pele is the god of football but that doesn't mean I don't like Maradona or Messi (specially). Maybe I have given a wrong impression with my arguments which is very unfortunate. I'm merely against exaggerations and over the top comments. Maradona to me is the second best player ever existed and Messi.... Messi is indisputably the best player in the world today and he's been for about afew years. He needs more things to reach the very top ones: winning everything there is to win, including WC trophies.
Ciao....
I never meant to say Maradona couldn't be successful without Careca. But he too, needed good players (not only average ones as many claim) around him to be successful even though not all of them were stars. and yes Pele is the god of football but that doesn't mean I don't like Maradona or Messi (specially). Maybe I have given a wrong impression with my arguments which is very unfortunate. I'm merely against exaggerations and over the top comments. Maradona to me is the second best player ever existed and Messi.... Messi is indisputably the best player in the world today and he's been for about afew years. He needs more things to reach the very top ones: winning everything there is to win, including WC trophies. Ciao....
thanks a lot guys...
Sly jun, this is what I get for listening to the media lol ;-)
(ISP being one) huh....;-) j/k
but it was on the iranian news so still a mystery to me :S
btw I cant like your post it says I dont have the permission ? heh.... Oh I refreshed and logged back in and then it worked! merci...
Sly jun, this is what I get for listening to the media lol ;-)
(ISP being one) huh....;-) j/k
but it was on the iranian news so still a mystery to me :S
btw I cant like your post it says I dont have the permission ? heh.... Oh I refreshed and logged back in and then it worked! merci...
