Paid the price of having so many legionaries

[backechap]

Hashemian and Zandi clearly are not used to our style of play and need more practice. A lot more! If they were playing par with our other players we could have won this game. Add to that the lack of practice of Kia, Rezaii, Kaabi, Karimi and Navidkia, and you got 6 out of 10 starting players (plus one sub)absent from most of our practices.

Other notes: Great job our defense, any time the defense doesn't give up a goal needs to be appreciated (I know we got lucky a couple times, but hey that's football).

Our offense sucked.

Our midfield played well, thanks mostly to Neekoo, except that our offense's contribution to the midfield sucked.

I'm a big Daei fan, but Daei played terrible. This style of play does not bode well with him, we needed someone more skillful to control the ball when balls got to him and the rest of the team were back in our 1/3 of the field. Coach should have subed him from min 60 on.

 

[Niloufar]

backechop jan,
great post!
but we have to admit,it wasnt legioners's fault. they were actually our most active players in the pitch.

but whats Hashemian's fault when he is used in his unusual position instead of centre forward?!thanx for including Daei in his position..
or what is Zandi's fault when he is not used as an attacking left wing(where he performs best) instead of defensive midfield.

but it would be great to bring in Mobali much earlier + Kazemian.heiff..

 

[zoozanagheh]

Good observations by both of you. Thanks for sharing it.
However, I think IFF could have solve this problem before it had become a problem! We had enough time to have friendlies with most of our legionaries (except for Zandi which was speciall case) during the new year holiday. How many friendlies did we have since we learned which teams we are going to face? If I am not mistaken, Panama and Bosnia were the only one, and they were not much fruitful games for our main lineup.

Also, I have to question our stragey and tactics, and emphasis on Niloufar's point (and others mentioned in various threads) that Hashemian and Zandi did not play in their position. Subing Daei would have allowed Hashemian and Zandi to move to a more proper position and be more effective, while having some one like NavidKia or Mobali inserted in middle to distribute the ball.

 

[Farbod (ADC)]

Every (good) national team has legionaires... Ours are just p*ssies that need constant coddling...

 

[Behrang(ISP)]

personally i don't think any of our players played well. i think it would be better if we setup camps in europe for a week before our matches... this way our foreign players could come to the practices etc. and still tend to their club teams. i think it would be better for us to do something like that... then again i'm not the coach and i'm not the federation... all of this takes money and i honestly dont' know how much they have...

 

[Bache Tehroon]

all of this takes money and i honestly dont' know how much they have...

$48/Barrel

 

[zoozanagheh]

$48/Barrel

Good one!

But I wish it was just like that:

($48/Barrel) - (haghe rahbari + bodjeye makhfi + kharje atomi + kharje anva o aghsame dam o dastgahe ettelati o herasati + baj o hagh o hesab be shorakaye khareji + kharje hezbolah che dar Iran che dar kharej + bekhor bekhore sepah o masolan o aghazadeh-ha o avan-o-ansare velayat o hozeh-ha + sokht o sooz dar asare bi-modiriyate va reshveh-khari va dozdi + ....) = ~ not much left!

Tazeh hamin ra ham bayad baraye rikht-o-pash va "mis-management"-e IFF va pardakhte bedehihaye bashgah-ha (mesle perspolis va esteghlal; ke dar edameye bekhor-bekhor-ha va a'dame modiriyate sahih hasel shode) sarf beshe!!!

 

[backechap]

personally i don't think any of our players played well. i think it would be better if we setup camps in europe for a week before our matches... this way our foreign players could come to the practices etc. and still tend to their club teams. i think it would be better for us to do something like that... then again i'm not the coach and i'm not the federation... all of this takes money and i honestly dont' know how much they have...

Behrang, I agree 100% that we need to do something to get our players practice more, setting up a camp in Europe is a geat idea if we can get the clubs to release players for a couple days a week, since the clubs' objections to releasing players may be due to the long travels and the fatigue that it causes.

For the other respondent who says that other good teams have legionaires, I don't know of a team that perfroms well in WCQ games and uses 7 foreign based players in a game. Do you? Maybe Brazil?

 

[Farbod (ADC)]

Behrang, I agree 100% that we need to do something to get our players practice more, setting up a camp in Europe is a geat idea if we can get the clubs to release players for a couple days a week, since the clubs' objections to releasing players may be due to the long travels and the fatigue that it causes.

For the other respondent who says that other good teams have legionaires, I don't know of a team that perfroms well in WCQ games and uses 7 foreign based players in a game. Do you?

Every South American Team, Czech Republic, Portugal, and France.... Good enough for you?

 

[zoozanagheh]

Behrang, I agree 100% that we need to do something to get our players practice more, setting up a camp in Europe is a geat idea if we can get the clubs to release players for a couple days a week, since the clubs' objections to releasing players may be due to the long travels and the fatigue that it causes.

For the other respondent who says that other good teams have legionaires, I don't know of a team that perfroms well in WCQ games and uses 7 foreign based players in a game. Do you?

I am not sure how they managed their WCQ, but Senegal team which advanced and palyed very well in last WC mainly consisted of legionaires.
Of course, if I am not mistaking, they mostly played in France which might have helped with their style of playing. Nevertheless, studying them may be useful to us.

 

[Bache Tehroon]

Yugoslavia, Croatia, Greece, Brazil, France, Holland, USA, Mexico, Argentina, Senegal, Cameroon, Russia, Sweden, Denmark and....

These teams are all mostly consisted of players who play in other countries.

 

[backechap]

BT, let me try to first say this:

We don't have to send the best 11 individual players on the field, we can instead send the best "TEAM" we have. There is a world of difference between the 2.

Now, let me explain, if you have time to read. What I'm saying is that we sent a team into pitch today that had very little practice time together. On top of that, it's going to be next to impossible to get more practice time for the European based ones until their club football season is over in Europe. For crying our loud, Zandi had 2 days of practice at most, and those 2 days were lite practices anyway. The same with Hashemian, though he had some previous experience with some of our players. To make it worse, as Nilou said, both were playing out of position. Kia also had 2 days of practice, but he's played with our team a lot more, and that showed today, since he did better on the field.

I compare this game against the game we played against Bosnia, where the core of our team was domestic players, and I see a world of difference. Yes, some of it was because we played in Iran, and some of it had to do with friendly vs official. But to me it is so obvious that today's team didn't have enough practice together. I had made a bet that Zandi will not start today which I lost! I basically trusted (mis-trusted) Branko's better judgment.

You tell me, if you were the coach, and having hindsight at your disposal, would you have sent in this team? Now go back and look at the very limited number of posts on the new site, see how many people were expressing concerns about our lack of practice? Well, it didn't really have to be this way, we don't have to send the best 11 individual players on the field, we can instead send the best "TEAM" we can. There is a world of difference between the 2.

I don't know how USA or Senegal can do it with their 11 players representing 9 or 10 different club teams, if that's really the case. Maybe they all play in the same style teams? Maybe they are foreign based, but some play for the same club? Maybe they get to practice together much more than a few lite sessions? What I do know is that we sent 11 of our "stars", but we didn't send a team. As a past amatuer player and part time coach, I would always choose a team over "stars", always. But hey, I'm not a paid coach, and I'm not a semi-pro or a pro as most others seem to be on this board, so what do I know?!

 

[Bache Tehroon]

you have valid points

 

[zoozanagheh]

Backe-chap, if I may say so, you have a better point now.
Back to your original question, I guess we mostly agree that it's possible to have a team consisting of foreign based players as the examples provided in several posts shows. However, it is not with out challenge and difficulty. In addition we should not compare, since the level of football is different in each of these countries, but we can learn from them to do better. Another obstacle for us is that Asian leagues calendars do not necessarily match the European one. We have 4 European based players and the rest play in Persian Gulf countries.
However, I think we had enough time to have friendlies and camp after we advanced to this round. With the exception of Zandi, we could have had a camp and friendly game during the new year holidays, at least, with our legionaries.
Branko was asked about the delay in the camp in Navad program, but he down played it and pretended that it was not in his hand and assured everyone that couple of practice session would be good enough.

As for your main point, whether to send 11 individual stars or a team that have played together, you got a point. I leave it to experts to discuss this, however, keep in mind the team that played against Bosnia was not impressive neither.

 

[Bijanirani]

Dear all,

Yes, you are correct that our team did not perform at its best. Yes, you are right that Zandi, Hashemian, and Kia may have not been fine tuned together. Almost all of your observations are correct. But, please remember that this was (psychologically) a tough game. We came out of it with one crucial point. Yes, three would have been better. But we got one and at the end that is what counts. This is not to say that we do not need to change anything. This is not to say that we need not more practice, more friendly, and more subs. It is just to say that, all in all, it was not that bad.

Best to all.

Bijan

 

[backechap]

Backe-chap, if I may say so, you have a better point now.
Back to your original question, I guess we mostly agree that it's possible to have a team consisting of foreign based players as the examples provided in several posts shows. However, it is not with out challenge and difficulty. In addition we should not compare, since the level of football is different in each of these countries, but we can learn from them to do better. Another obstacle for us is that Asian leagues calendars do not necessarily match the European one. We have 4 European based players and the rest play in Persian Gulf countries.
However, I think we had enough time to have friendlies and camp after we advanced to this round. With the exception of Zandi, we could have had a camp and friendly game during the new year holidays, at least, with our legionaries.
Branko was asked about the delay in the camp in Navad program, but he down played it and pretended that it was not in his hand and assured everyone that couple of practice session would be good enough.

As for your main point, whether to send 11 individual stars or a team that have played together, you got a point. I leave it to experts to discuss this, however, keep in mind the team that played against Bosnia was not impressive neither.

Yes, you're right, it is possible. But the reality is that we have NEVER been able to pull our players together and have a good camp for WCQ games ever since we started having European based players. So it is something more than Branko's fault that this is not happening. BUT, it is Branko who could have put together a more coherent team together. And there lies the blame, if there is such a thing. I agree with you that the 1 point we got today, and especially the 2 points we didn't let Bahrain get are good. But I disagree that the team that played against Bosni did not do well. They did terrific. Go look at the game and you would see that the Bosni team was playing a much more pressing game (but similar style as Bahrain), and yet we were playing a very fluid and fast paced game.

You know a lot of times the difference between a good team and a bad one is that one-touch pass that breaks the press, that one successful give and go (yek-do), and that one good cross, all of which were present in the Bosni game.

 

[zoozanagheh]

Backe-chap, I get your point and I think you have a valid argument, I just do not find myself knowledgeable enough to discuss it further. However, I would like to first mention some points in order to make myself more clear and then raise a question to you regarding Bosnia game:

- regarding camp and friendlies with foreign based players, I do not blame Branko only, I think it’s TM management (including head coach) and IFF in general. As you mentioned we have had this problem for a while and they have not been able to learn from past experience and other football federations who are in similar condition. Mentioning Branko’s interview was just to point out that the concern was raised by some media in Iran.
- I have not said 1 point is enough (as some other members suggested it), of course it’s better than the embarrassment that we had 3-4 years ago and it’s better than no points at all. But I subscribe to the mentality that we had to go for win rather than tie. To me it’s a mistake to try to aim for 10 points, we need to aim for all points possible, if we do not get it and end up with 10 points we might still be in a good position to advance, that’s no excuse to not go for win – specially against a team that’s considered 3rd seed of the group and we managed to beat them not long ago with two goal difference in a neutral field. Worst than all, was the performance (both as a team and as individual) and not the result that bothered me.

As for Bosnia game, did you find the defensive line to be reliable? Was G.Mohammadi able to do his duty properly? Do not you think the addition of Zandi and Rezaei (both foreign based players) enabled Branko to place GM in its proper position and have a more reliable defense line?

 

[backechap]

...

As for Bosnia game, did you find the defensive line to be reliable? Was G.Mohammadi able to do his duty properly? Do not you think the addition of Zandi and Rezaei (both foreign based players) enabled Branko to place GM in its proper position and have a more reliable defense line

Yes, you have a good point.

 

[Mike2005]

I think if Azizi plays, we have more scoring chances. He does lots of dirty works that no one else like to do. He makes few mistakes but he gets one or two times right and we score. I thinkhe also brings good luck for the team when he plays.