US govt secretly collecting data on millions of Verizon users

ashtar

National Team Player
Aug 17, 2003
5,448
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#1
US govt secretly collecting data on millions of Verizon users: Report
By Olivier Knox, Yahoo! News

Can you hear me now?


Eep. The National Security Agency (NSA) has been collecting telephone records of millions of Verizon customers – right down to local call data – undera top-secret court order issued in April, Britain’sThe Guardian newspaper reported late Wednesday. UPDATE: The Administration responds, defending a "critical tool" against terrorism and underlining that the government is not listening in on anyone's calls.

Under the Foreign Intelligence Surveillance Court (FISC) order, the Guardian reported, Verizon Business Services must provide the NSA “on an ongoing daily basis” with information from calls between the U.S. and overseas – but also with calls entirely inside the United States. Calls made entirely overseas were not affected. It was unclear whether phones in other Verizon divisions -- its regular cell phone operations, for instance -- were similarly targeted.

Guardian writer Glenn Greenwald, a frequent and fierce critic of the national security state’s expansion since 9-11, writes in his bombshell report that:

The document shows for the first time that under the Obama administration the communication records of millions of US citizens are being collected indiscriminately and in bulk – regardless of whether they are suspected of any wrongdoing.

The order, issued April 25 and valid through July 19, requires Verizon to turn over the numbers of both parties, location data, call duration, and other information – though not the contents of the calls.

The White House initially declined comment, but a senior administration official defended the activities described the activities described in the Guardian piece without confirming the specific report.

"On its face, the order reprinted in the article does not allow the Government to listen in on anyone's telephone calls," the official, who requested anonymity, said by email. "The information acquired does not include the content of any communications or the name of any subscriber."

And "information of the sort described in the Guardian article has been a critical tool in protecting the nation from terrorist threats to the United States, as it allows counterterrorism personnel to discover whether known or suspected terrorists have been in contact with other persons who may be engaged in terrorist activities, particularly people located inside the United States," the official said.

Congress has been "regularly and fully briefed" on such practices, which occur under a "robust legal regime" and "strict controls and procedures...to ensure that they comply with the Constitution and laws of the United States and appropriately protect privacy and civil liberties," the official said.

Judge Roger Vinson’s order relies on Section 215 of the PATRIOT Act. That part of the law, also known as the “business records provision,” permits FBI agents to seek a court order for “any tangible things (including books, records, papers, documents, and other items)” it deems relevant to an investigation.

Democratic Sen. Ron Wyden of Oregon, who sits on the Senate Intelligence Committee, has repeatedlysounded the alarm about the way the government interprets that provision -- though he is sharply limited in what he can say about classified information. Wyden and Democratic Sen. Mark Udall of Colorado, another committee member, wrote a scathing letter to Attorney General Eric Holder in Sept. 2011 warning that Americans would be "stunned" if they learned what the government was doing.

The American Civil Liberties Union (ACLU) denounced the scope of the surveillance. "It’s analogous to the FBI stationing an agent outside every home in the country to track who goes in and who comes out," said Jameel Jaffer, ACLU Deputy Legal Director. The organization's Legislative Counsel, Michelle Richardson, bluntly branded the surveillance "unconstitutional" and insisted that "the government should end it and disclose its full scope, and Congress should initiate a full investigation."

And former vice president Al Gore, on Twitter, sharply condemned the government's actions:

In digital era, privacy must be a priority. Is it just me, or is secret blanket surveillance obscenely outrageous?



http://news.yahoo.com/blogs/ticket/us-govt-secretly-collecting-data-millions-verizon-users-013542225.html

 

Irani

IPL Player
Oct 19, 2002
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#2
LOL…

Once I read, there was a Russian who left Russia and settled in Canada. Watching TV one night, he heard a furniture advertiser to say: We stand behind our sofa’s. He got up and screamed that was WHY he left Russia.

Technology has advanced so much that no one needs to stand behind furniture or snoop on another person.

There is no democracy, not only in Iran but also in other countries. When Western Presidents make speeches they distract masses… Bush, Obama, Cameron, Brown,…. Make no difference; they are puppets in hands of big corporations.

As I have written before, in third world countries there is political dictatorship, in Western countries, there is corporate dictatorship.

In the 1974-1976 time frame in the USA, at the conclusion of an investigation, Frank Church, the Democratic senator from Idaho who chaired the investigative committee, warned: "The NSA's capability at any time could be turned around on the American people, and no American would have any privacy left, such is the capability to onitor everything: telephone conversations, telegrams, it doesn't matter."
In recent years this has happened.
Here is another link to the same story.
http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/2013/jun/06/nsa-phone-records-verizon-court-order
 
Oct 18, 2002
11,593
3
#3
As I have written before, in third world countries there is political dictatorship, in Western countries, there is corporate dictatorship.
Do you even know what dictatorship means? and how this piece of news is corporate dictatorship? which corporate? Verizon?
 

Ardesheer

Bench Warmer
Jun 30, 2005
1,580
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#4
These guys' job is to find something in the news, and equate what goes on in Iran with what goes on in the U.S. Wait, General is going to show up soon.
 

Irani

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Oct 19, 2002
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#6
There was an article that several Presidents of the USA were forcing South American countries to accept AT&T’s system for their phone system… we urge you to use AT&T was stated in that article four times. This was in 1970s. (I should find that article).
In 2010’s, it is Verizon, Exxon/Mobile and Boeing (to name a few) playing the role(s) of Corporate Dictators.

Western news media bombard(ed) the world with the notion that other countries are envious of their freedom.
LOL.
George W. Bush said: … they hate us for our freedom and democracy (Press conference, Oct. 11, 2001)

Westerners cannot think that … they don't hate us because we bomb them, invade them, kill them, and destroy their infrastructure.
LOL.

More on political vs. corporate dictators later.
 

Ardesheer

Bench Warmer
Jun 30, 2005
1,580
1
#7
If you get insulted when someone challenges what you say, then don't post anything. Show me one word of insult in my previous post. You keep going around and accusing anyone who challenges you. You know nothing about freedom of expression. I have no control over this board, so how am I limiting your freedom of expression? For once come off of your high horse and realize that there are people much more elequant, well-rounded and logical than you, e.g. BT.
 

Irani

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Oct 19, 2002
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#8
If you get insulted when someone challenges what you say, then don't post anything. Show me one word of insult in my previous post. You keep going around and accusing anyone who challenges you. You know nothing about freedom of expression. I have no control over this board, so how am I limiting your freedom of expression? For once come off of your high horse and realize that there are people much more elequant, well-rounded and logical than you, e.g. BT.
LOL. Look at your intellect and what you stated under this thread. You consider what you have disliked a “contribution?”

Insult does not have to be a profanity .. it could be supporting those who say it or changing words saying… blah blah… do you remember that? Do you remember what you said about “freedom of speech?”, when you were cornered you narrowed it so much that turned into a joke?

Why did you mention General in reply to my post? If you have a problem with him, deal with him you ... You are lying by accusing others then …. saying … that is not insult? Grow up and tell others who you mentioned also to grow up. Thanks.
 
Oct 18, 2002
11,593
3
#9
There was an article that several Presidents of the USA were forcing South American countries to accept AT&T’s system for their phone system… we urge you to use AT&T was stated in that article four times. This was in 1970s. (I should find that article).
In 2010’s, it is Verizon, Exxon/Mobile and Boeing (to name a few) playing the role(s) of Corporate Dictators.
Again, what this piece of news has to do with corporate dictatorship? Did you even read the first post? It is about Verizon being forced to hand over customer log files to the Federal government. Some corporate dictator, this Verizon!
 

byebyenow

Elite Member
Jun 3, 2006
4,962
175
#12
How could anybody still defend their actions, this is pathetic!
[video=youtube;WcgR057wgoQ]https://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_detailpage&v=WcgR057wgoQ[/video]
 

Irani

IPL Player
Oct 19, 2002
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#13
Again, what this piece of news has to do with corporate dictatorship? Did you even read the first post? It is about Verizon being forced to hand over customer log files to the Federal government. Some corporate dictator, this Verizon!
deerouz khan; I have written about corporate interests and corporate dictators ….I should not get into discussion(s) at ISP about this topic. Moreover, I do not have access to AT&T article which it is now replaced by Verizon… actually T-Mobile has done similar thing(s).

I will leave you with few sentences here . . .
…. the Western governments and their corporate dictators have supported political dictators in the Middle East and other parts of the world. This has been done against the will of people in the name of "stability" not for democracy. In any democratic country, corporate economic dictators will not survive. Similar to political dictators, the corrupt relationship between economic and political interests will not survive….
 

Bache Tehroon

Elite Member
Oct 16, 2002
39,533
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DarvAze DoolAb
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#14
deerouz khan; I have written about corporate interests and corporate dictators ….I should not get into discussion(s) at ISP about this topic. Moreover, I do not have access to AT&T article which it is now replaced by Verizon… actually T-Mobile has done similar thing(s).

I will leave you with few sentences here . . .
…. the Western governments and their corporate dictators have supported political dictators in the Middle East and other parts of the world. This has been done against the will of people in the name of "stability" not for democracy. In any democratic country, corporate economic dictators will not survive. Similar to political dictators, the corrupt relationship between economic and political interests will not survive….
Okay fine. Let's assume everything you just wrote, and the articles you refer to are all correct.

WHAT THE FUCK DOES IT HAVE TO DO WITH THIS THREAD?!!!
 

Ardesheer

Bench Warmer
Jun 30, 2005
1,580
1
#15
LOL. Look at your intellect and what you stated under this thread. You consider what you have disliked a “contribution?”

Insult does not have to be a profanity .. it could be supporting those who say it or changing words saying… blah blah… do you remember that? Do you remember what you said about “freedom of speech?”, when you were cornered you narrowed it so much that turned into a joke?

Why did you mention General in reply to my post? If you have a problem with him, deal with him you ... You are lying by accusing others then …. saying … that is not insult? Grow up and tell others who you mentioned also to grow up. Thanks.
Man, are you on some sort of a medication? For the life of me, I read your post and I don't understand what you are talking about and what your point is. What the heck does this mean "Insult does not have to be a profanity .. it could be supporting those who say it or changing words saying… blah blah… do you remember that?" And this guy is the proclaimed intellectual that lectures all over the world, has written books on every subject, etc.
 

maziar95

Elite Member
Oct 20, 2002
2,285
63
39
Baltimore, MD
#16
I use to work for Verizon and they always kept all phone records and text records but not the content of the phone calls or the messages because that's impossible for a company that has nearly 100 million customers in the US . The only records they keep is the date/time/location of the phone number the call/text originated/received. Verizon also keeps records of all the websites customers visit on their smartphones . I don't think its a big deal because the main reason the Obama admiration is doing this is to see if anyone in the US is contacting "persons of interest " outside of the US . There should be no reason why a US resident is making a phone call to a terrorist in Afghanistan or Pakistan. What bothers me the most is the fact that Verizon employees have access to records of anyone that uses a Verizon cellphone in the US , lets not forget a Verizon employee was able to get access to Obamas phone records a few years ago right before he became a president .
 

IEI

Administrator
Staff member
Nov 10, 2002
14,505
3,340
#17
This is more than Verizon, it is about all tech companies including Google, Microsoft, Apple, Yahoo, Facebook and pretty much all of them
If you think that US government doesn't monitor your data, you are a very naive person

US collects data on virtually everyone, leaked docs reveal

This story is getting bigger and bigger. Even though most Americans probably already knew, it is now official: the United States government, through its National Security Agency, is collecting the communications and data of all American citizens, and of non-Americans using American services, through a wide collaboration with the large companies in technology, like Apple, Google, Microsoft, Facebook, and so on. Interestingly enough, the NSA itself, as well as the US government, have repeatedly and firmly denied this massive spying on Americans and non-Americans took place at all.

The project is called PRISM, which is fitting when you think about how data travels through fibre these days. The Washing Post has gained access to a set of very detailed slides from the NSA explaining how it all all works and who the NSA is collaborating with, and it includes all the big names in technology, from Apple to Facebook, from Google to Microsoft. It covers all information flows, whether from Americans or non-Americans. Considering virtually each and every one of uses one or more American services or software products, we are all targets. Nearly 1 in 7 intelligence reports in the US is now based on PRISM data.

What's most peculiar is that the companies involved in PRISM all deny being part of it. The Washington Post contacted the companies involved, and Facebook and Apple said they have no knowledge of the program, and thus are not involved with it - which is odd, because the official government documentation clearly mentioned them. The Verge contacted Google, and the search and advertisement giant, too, denies involvement - even though they, and several of its companies like youTube, are listed as well. Microsoft was the first company to join the program (and is also denying involvement, others joined in later. Twitter has yet to join.

The PRISM program has access to everything - phone call recordings, file transfers, browsing history, email, your files stored on the internet, and so on. Just about anything you can imagine is part of PRISM. Suddenly, it starts to make even more sense why China is so hell-bent on creating its own alternatives to American products and services; they obviously knew about PRISM long before we did.

The program is technically legal and court-approved (by the FISA court), but that's only because that FISA court convenes in secret, behind closed doors, is unchecked by the people, and rarely releases any documentation whatsoever. "I would just push back on the idea that the court has signed off on it, so why worry?" Jameel Jaffer, deputy legal director of the American Civil Liberties Union, told the Washington post, "This is a court that meets in secret, allows only the government to appear before it, and publishes almost none of its opinions. It has never been an effective check on government.”

What's more, when under oath only a few months ago in March 2013, the NSA, by mouth of director of national intelligence James Clapper, denied that the NSA and the US government was spying on its citizens. Six minutes and forty seconds in, a clearly fidgeting and uncomfortable Clapper responds "No sir. Not wittingly." Looking back, it's clear the guy is lying, as he's showing all the telltale signs.

Clapper is clearly disconnected from reality, as his response to the uncovering of PRISM is borderline idiotic. In several press releases, he reiterates the program is legal (and thus, confirms its existence), and that the reports by The Washington Post and The Guardian contain several inaccuracies - but as a crystal clear sign of weakness, he doesn't actually detail the supposed inaccuracies. Furthermore, and this is where he really goes off his rocker, he accuses the two newspapers of endangering the lives of Americans, and that reporting on PRISM is "reprehensible".

Information collected under this program is among the most important and valuable foreign intelligence information we collect, and is used to protect our nation from a wide variety of threats.

The unauthorized disclosure of information about this important and entirely legal program is reprehensible and risks important protections for the security of Americans.

PRISM isn't even the worst of it. The NSA has collected records on every phone call made in the US in the last seven years, and has that data stored on servers right now. In addition, the NSA receives data on every American from US internet service providers and credit card companies. Combine PRISM data with this additional data - and probably from a variety of other sources - and it's pretty clear the US is now officially a surveillance state, not much better or worse than China. In addition, the NSA has collected loads of information on non-Americans as well, which looks a lot like an act of aggression against foreign, independent nations to me.

But, my dear American and non-American friends, you need not worry. That same man, director of national intelligence James Clapper, says we can all safely go to sleep since the US government is bound by law and can't sift through all this data at will. Of course, we all trust the US government. Right?

By order of the FISC, the Government is prohibited from indiscriminately sifting through the telephony metadata acquired under the program. All information that is acquired under this program is subject to strict, court-imposed restrictions on review and handling. The court only allows the data to be queried when there is a reasonable suspicion, based on specific facts, that the particular basis for the query is associated with a foreign terrorist organization. Only specially cleared counterterrorism personnel specifically trained in the Court-approved procedures may even access the records.

This scandal is growing like an oil stain, and even though the supposed 'legal' nature of it all will most likely mean nothing will happen, you'd hope some heads are going to roll here. Ideally, the program would be stopped the data destroyed, but that will never happen. It's a universal truth in governance that a government's power can only grow; it can never shrink. Once power is owned, it is never released. Government don't shrink; they either grow, or topple.

One thing is clear though: while we were all worrying about data collected by Google, Microsoft, Facebook, Apple, and others - we should have been focussing on the government all along. Just remember that if you buy an Xbox One, your next game console will have a microphone-equipped camera permanently peering into your living room, built by the first company to join the PRISM program.

It has been quoted to death the past 30 years, but we can now safely say that George Orwell was right - he was just off by 30 years. Welcome to the surveillance state.
 
Last edited:
Jun 9, 2004
13,753
1
Canada
#18
I don't have so much of a problem with them collecting the data, as I do with them not using the damn data that they collect!!! It's retarded to invade people's privacy just for the heck of it. If you're doing it to "protect me", then at least use the data to protect me. Everytime anything goes wrong lately it's the same "oh yeah, we knew about this person, but didn't do anything about it"! :(