Hands down, Xavi. While the other 2 get a lot of notoriety being more prolific goal scorers and flashy, Xavi has been the heart and soul of both Spain and barcelona for years. Don't believe me, compare Argentina, Portugal and Spain's performance in the last world cup, not just results, but the actual play too.
Messi is bossing the game in Xavi's presence. That should count too. I know Xavi deserves it, but credit should be given to Messi for turning into a monster in Xavi's presence. It takes lots of character. He could easily remain the Messi he used to be and feed off Xavi's brilliance without losing sleep, but he turned the tides and is actually giving as much as getting these days. It'll be a long time before such a brilliant combination ever gets repeated. They should give it to Mexavi or Xassi
I have a friend that thinks Barca would NOT win anything if it wasnt for Messi , the fact that they won their first CL after 96 years is a proof to him.
i dont agree and think while Messi certainly improves Barca, Messi needs Barca as much as they need Messi, and to me Argentia is the proof.
while Xavi, Iniesta, Puyol, Bousquet, Villa, Pedro, Cesc , Pique are world cup and Euro winners, Messi has NOT achieved ANYTHING without these guys.
please share your opinion.
Thank you,
i dont agree and think while Messi certainly improves Barca, Messi needs Barca as much as they need Messi, and to me Argentia is the proof.
while Xavi, Iniesta, Puyol, Bousquet, Villa, Pedro, Cesc , Pique are world cup and Euro winners, Messi has NOT achieved ANYTHING without these guys.
please share your opinion.
Thank you,
we only would know the answer if Messi plays in another club. He is definitely amazing but Xavi and Iniesta have won almost every title and the way they control the midfield gives opportunity to the forwards to move freely. Remember Barcelona won with Eto and no Messi around.
so in short No ... Barcelona is about the team ... Real Madrid is about individuality ...
so in short No ... Barcelona is about the team ... Real Madrid is about individuality ...
if i kindly ask everyone leave Real Madrid out so we stick to the topic.
to me the fact that Messi can NOT produce the same effect for Argentina as for Barcelona is proof enough he needs the players around him as much as they need him, look at Spain for example they dont win anything for 44 years and all of a sudden they win Euro and World Cup ! the last time i checked Messi did NOT play there !
to me the fact that Messi can NOT produce the same effect for Argentina as for Barcelona is proof enough he needs the players around him as much as they need him, look at Spain for example they dont win anything for 44 years and all of a sudden they win Euro and World Cup ! the last time i checked Messi did NOT play there !
I think Messi excels because of Barcelona, not the other way around. While I admit Messi is a great player, very talented and smart, Barcelona without him would have accomplished most of what it did. Clearly, Messi in his position in Barcelona is better than almost anybody Barcelona could replace him with, but he is not the main reason for Barcelona's success. In short, I would attribute about 10-15% of Barcelona's success to Messi. Similarly, I would attribute about 50% of Messi's success to Barcelona. Case in point, as I mentioned in other threads already, and has been mentioned in this thread, Messi accomplished nothing with Argentina in the last WC, while Spain, the core of which was centered around the great Spanish players in Barcelona, won it all. The same core group of Spanish players also won WC titles in younger years and the Euro Cup, etc. I think that pretty much says all that needs to be said on the subject.
I contribute 50% of Barca's success to Messi but around 90% of Messi's success to Barca.
Barcelona under Guardiola is a team of great individuals and on top the greatest individual talent in ages woven seamlessly into the collective. Sorry that I have to use the Ronaldo comparison, but Madrid with Ronaldo is a great team with a great individual talent, but he's not really part of the team, he does his own thing.
Messi with Barca is just a great team. Madrid kind of is 10+Ronaldo while Barca is Messi+10. It's a fine difference. It's also the reason Argentina doesn't work well because while Messi is a great individual talent he is too much used to the team and can only excel in the team as part of it. However, it is expected of him to be an outlier position to play the ball to whenever they don't know what to do.
Barcelona under Guardiola is a team of great individuals and on top the greatest individual talent in ages woven seamlessly into the collective. Sorry that I have to use the Ronaldo comparison, but Madrid with Ronaldo is a great team with a great individual talent, but he's not really part of the team, he does his own thing.
Messi with Barca is just a great team. Madrid kind of is 10+Ronaldo while Barca is Messi+10. It's a fine difference. It's also the reason Argentina doesn't work well because while Messi is a great individual talent he is too much used to the team and can only excel in the team as part of it. However, it is expected of him to be an outlier position to play the ball to whenever they don't know what to do.
It's funny with Argentina they have such a talented squad offensively. Aguero, Higuain, Messi, Tevez, Lavezzi but there are no playmakers like Xavi in the midfield to hold the ball and distribute well. The team has no balance
I think that year they blew it against Germany with Riquelme (big part of it), Ayala, Gabi Milito and Pekerman was their most complete team in recent years. Nowadays they don't really have the talent in midfield or defense.
I think that year they blew it against Germany with Riquelme (big part of it), Ayala, Gabi Milito and Pekerman was their most complete team in recent years. Nowadays they don't really have the talent in midfield or defense.