How good is our current crop of players (old school ISP)

[Babak G]

Hello guys,

Some of you may remember me from a while back and some of you may have read some of my articles. But I think a majority of you wont know who I am! Unfortunately professional commitments meant that I could not contribute here as much as I would've liked. Now a fractured elbow has put me under house arrest sort of so I wanted to spend a few moments here too.

Enough stalling.

The topic is self-explanatory. How good are these players? Ive not been watching IPL in ages, and the only club footie from Iran that I have seen has been Zobahans semi and final in ACL. But the national team I have followed avidly as always.

Looking at this squad, I would argue its one of the weakest (ability-wise) I have seen since I began watching us in 1996. Worryingly its also the second oldest in the Asian Cup! Rebuilding? The future? Not too sure.

 

[xoraster]

No doubt that Iran has failed to produce new stars at the same calibre as before.

Having said that, I think that Iran has more players, and more depth than before.

In the old days, we could have Daei and Azizi next to Ostad Asadi and Shahroudi. Or Karimi next to a Halali. Bagheri next to Ghoalmpour.

Today, a decent coach would be able to pick a more even squad with not a lot of highs but not so many lows either.

One example is the left wing situation where players such as Milad Zanidpour, Feschangchi (not in squad) and Arash Afshin, Hajsafi (in squad) are available.

For goalkeepers, we have even 2 high calibre keepers (Rahmati, Gordan) with youngsters such as Haghighi and Sadeghi ready to take over.

Having said that, I do believe that Ghotbis picks have been lazy with not a lot of efforts to find new players and new solutions to old problems (such as slow central defence, lack of central playmaker, lack of central penetration).

More than Asian Cup, the key to Irans future for the next 3-4 years will be the Omid team. Will the new coach be able to introduce Alidoustis U19 stars (Sadeghian, Rezaei, Pouraliganji, Alishah, Yaghub Karimi, Goudarzi) into the Omids, because right now, current Omid team looks as pale and depressing as previous Omid team coached by Begovic.

 

[mashdi]

Now a fractured elbow has put me under house arrest sort of so I wanted to spend a few moments here too.

You shouldn't have shaken hands with Big Sam when he was leaving Blackburn.:drunk:

Good to see you back Babak and hope you get well soon.

 

[Babak G]

You shouldn't have shaken hands with Big Sam when he was leaving Blackburn.:drunk:

Good to see you back Babak and hope you get well soon.

Thanks mashdi jaan!

 

[Babak G]

No doubt that Iran has failed to produce new stars at the same calibre as before.

Having said that, I think that Iran has more players, and more depth than before.

In the old days, we could have Daei and Azizi next to Ostad Asadi and Shahroudi. Or Karimi next to a Halali. Bagheri next to Ghoalmpour.

Today, a decent coach would be able to pick a more even squad with not a lot of highs but not so many lows either.

One example is the left wing situation where players such as Milad Zanidpour, Feschangchi (not in squad) and Arash Afshin, Hajsafi (in squad) are available.

For goalkeepers, we have even 2 high calibre keepers (Rahmati, Gordan) with youngsters such as Haghighi and Sadeghi ready to take over.

Having said that, I do believe that Ghotbis picks have been lazy with not a lot of efforts to find new players and new solutions to old problems (such as slow central defence, lack of central playmaker, lack of central penetration).

More than Asian Cup, the key to Irans future for the next 3-4 years will be the Omid team. Will the new coach be able to introduce Alidoustis U19 stars (Sadeghian, Rezaei, Pouraliganji, Alishah, Yaghub Karimi, Goudarzi) into the Omids, because right now, current Omid team looks as pale and depressing as previous Omid team coached by Begovic.

I am talking about the last 15 years. Id argue that our current crop is one of the weakest in recent memory. I hold true that the golden generation was around 2001/2002, at a time which we FAILED to qualify for the WC.

The acid test for this team is this tournament.

Times have changed. I look at the other sides, notably Japan, Korea, Uzbekistan, even UAE and Syria and I see they are producing a better level of players on the Asian level.

I worry that soon enough we no longer be one of the top 4-5 in Asia. I remember the days we used to debate whether we were the best or Japan, Korea! Those days are long gone!

How many of our players could make it in Europe? I dont see many. Before you say Khalatbari (27-28) or Rezaei (27), Id say they broke through too late to make it in Europe. I was shocked when I realized Khalatbari is that old.

 

[DireStraits]

Based on the first game I will vote for Rahmati to be a star. Maybe the best in Asia.
NN, Shojaei and Borhani are still usefull. I would prefer to use Shojaei another position
perhaps CF.
I think a team like this has more potential than old days where AZIZI and DAEI were
our only key players. Since now there are many good players in many positions.
So we should not play like those days where every one tried to find Daei and once Daei
and Azizi were covered no one else could score. Our defense make still faults. Lets hope
the newcomers including Borhani show they have been missed.

 

[Babak G]

Borhani a newcomer? He isnt even in the squad. Plus he has been around for 10 years at least now!

Let's put it this way into perspective.

15 years ago, how many players from other sides in Asia would we have taken into our side if we had the chance? There were very few stars around. And the quality of Asian football wasnt that high. In general, the quality has increased, but has the development in other countries been more progressive in Iran? I would say probably yes.

In every match, there are players who I'd say I wish they were Iranian. Don't you?

 

[Dr Strangemoosh]

The current starting XI is relatively good. Not the best that we have had over last 16 years but one of the better ones.

But the current depth in the squad and in particular the talent pool of IPL/azadegan is worse than it has ever been in my opinion. I dont think the new generation of starlets is anyway near as talented as previous crops.

Considering the impetus that came about after WC98, the immense lack of talent coming through in iran now (compared to other asian countries, and also compared to the last 2 decades) is very very worrying.

 

[Babak G]

The current starting XI is relatively good. Not the best that we have had over last 16 years but one of the better ones.

But the current depth in the squad and in particular the talent pool of IPL/azadegan is worse than it has ever been in my opinion. I dont think the new generation of starlets is anyway near as talented as previous crops.

Considering the impetus that came about after WC98, the immense lack of talent coming through in iran now (compared to other asian countries, and also compared to the last 2 decades) is very very worrying.

Exactly what I am thinking. It is worrying when one looks only at Iran, but when you then compare to what's going on in other Asian countries, I think its a critical situation. I mentioned it after the WC in 2006 that we couldnt see where the next batch of talent would come from, and even though we have had a few decent players since, they were all in their mid-to-late 20's.

Just to elaborate, look at our AC squad and see how many will be around in 2014.

 

[mashdi]

It all starts at Club level.most IPL Clubs are investing heavily to buy the so called stars and even less star-like foreign imports , and not much in local youth development.if this trend continues TM will soon face a serious talent drought.

 

[Babak G]

I dont think we have that many foreign players in the country to be nagging about it! 2-3 max at each club? If that even. Convenient excuse.

Problem is much deeper. Its infrastructure. Grass roots. Small academies and youth teams starting from 6-8 years of age in order to recruit the boys into a proper school of football. But when the coaching is still light years behind, who will teach them? Very few modern coaches, forget about forward thinking. Our coaches need proper qualifications. And playing football as a pro is NOT a qualification on its own. Otherwise why do all former stars from Europe go on and study for their badges?

 

[mashdi]

Babak.

Take a look at how much money is spent on domestic stars plus foreign players and compare that to the budget of Clubs' youth academies.you'll realize my point.not the only reason though as you correctly pointed out.infrastructure and grass roots should also be supported by Clubs , but they are more concerned about immediate success or survival in the League.

Coaching is like you said at a very low state in terms of modern football education.the same old coaches keep circulating around from one club to another.

 

[xoraster]

With the amount of money in IPL, few coaches dare to play youngsters.

Often, it has been foreign coaches such as Begovic, Bonacic (plus few local coaches such as MK) who have given youngsters a chance.

For example, our U16 team defeated Holland in WC.
Most of the Dutch players (who are now around 18-19) play regularly in the Dutch league while none of the players from that Iranian squad has made it as a starter in IPL.

One of many reasons why I am not impressed with local coaches is their inability to give young players a chance and before you say there are none, I would say that the crop of the team that made it to U 17 WC and even qualified from their group is just about the best young group of Iranian players I have seen, not only in terms of ability, but dicipline, tactical awareness and international experience.

The same Dutch players lost to Iran are now playing regularly in teams such as Feynoord while the stars if the Iranian team cannot get a game in Malavan and Naft Tehran.

 

[Foo]

The same Dutch players lost to Iran are now playing regularly in teams such as Feynoord while the stars if the Iranian team cannot get a game in Malavan and Naft Tehran.

Well most of them are still in the youth academies, only the Feyenoord ones play and that's because Feyenoord's financial situation is terrible and they can't buy players, so they're forced to put in the youth players. Labyad is getting more and more chances at PSV and Maher made his debut for AZ recently. The rest are still youth players, however I do see your point. Iranian clubs should give more chances to youth players, who can grow and improve the quality of the club and the national team. I've voiced my concerns about this in the past, especially the quality of the youth system, and also given some possible solutions (based on what I see in Europe). The point is that something has to happen.

 

[Babak G]

We've been saying it for years, but nothing changes. I believe the gap between the best three Asian sides (inc. Aussies) and us is greater than before, and the gap behind us with the rest is much closer than ever. That is not to say I think we are the 4th strongest side.

On our best day we may beat any of the sides in Asia although I have my doubts about Jap/Aus but it doesnt change the reality that there is a real danger that talent has dried up; the same individual talent that got us out of sticky situations in the past. We were famous for it all over Asia.

 

[xoraster]

Besides, next generation of Japanese and Korean players are world class.
Like the player that was just signed by Arsenal, or couple of 18-19 year old Koreans that play in Germany and France already.

By the time that generation breakthrough the ranks in European clubs, Korea and Japan will be chasing the worlds best sides while we will have to watch for China and Uzbeks.

I wrote an editorial before, 3-4 years ago were I warned that in the future, Iran will have a team consisting mainly of Iranian/UAE based players whilst Japan, Aust and Korea will field squads playing in the best leagues in the world and that seems to be the case.

The level of Japanese football is so high that they have a player dominating in Bundesliga, and he was not even in their WC squad.

Japan and Korea even qualified from their groups in WC and obviously, looking for ways to make it even further while for us even make it to 2014 seems like an enormous and right now, unlikely achievement .

 

[Babak G]

Im more worried about the emergence of UAE (STRONG YOUTH SET UP), Uzbeks, Syria, Jordan (beating us would have been unheard of only a few years ago), Qatar, North Korea, etc...

 

[Farsi Zaban]

The most talented team we ever had for AC was the 2000 team. Too many egos and poor coaching destroyed that team. 2007 was probably the 2nd most talented side, followed closely by 2004. I'd rate 1996 team about the same as this current team perhaps even slightly higher. Xoraster is right that the 1996 team didn't have too many quality players beside our 3 stars. The difference is that our average players, in comparison to other teams of that time were still good. Sadavi, Minavand, Mansourian, Khakpour, Abedzadeh(even Nakisa) and Estili were all quite decent by Asian standards. We even had high caliber players that weren't used in that particular tourney due to MK stupidity. Our 3 stars were beyond Asia.

 

[Babak G]

The most talented team we ever had for AC was the 2000 team. Too many egos and poor coaching destroyed that team. 2007 was probably the 2nd most talented side, followed closely by 2004. I'd rate 1996 team about the same as this current team perhaps even slightly higher. Xoraster is right that the 1996 team didn't have too many quality players beside our 3 stars. The difference is that our average players, in comparison to other teams of that time were still good. Sadavi, Minavand, Mansourian, Khakpour, Abedzadeh(even Nakisa) and Estili were all quite decent by Asian standards. We even had high caliber players that weren't used in that particular tourney due to MK stupidity. Our 3 stars were beyond Asia.

Again you are vindicating what Im saying. The quality of Asian players has improved at a faster rate than that of Iranian players. That's the big worry.
Look at the Saudis. They have arguably fallen into the same trap as us over the last 3 or so years.

 

[Foo]

Again you are vindicating what Im saying. The quality of Asian players has improved at a faster rate than that of Iranian players. That's the big worry.
Look at the Saudis. They have arguably fallen into the same trap as us over the last 3 or so years.

That's true, until 2002 Japan & S.Korea were still waiting for their first WC win, and 8 years later they both make it to the second round (they did so then as well, Korea becoming 4th, but u could argue they were the hosts etc.). Those countries are developing with organized and professional youth programs. The increased quality of players attracts interest from European teams (just look at players like Kagawa and Honda going to Europe at younger ages), which in turn increases the quality of the national team. It also motivates more developments etc. which continues the improvement. Iran, however, depends purely on individual talent and that's never a solid basis. We're stuck in the same place and in football no progress=regress.