Probably because Sepahan is a better team and he gets paid more.
I agree, I don't want to argue Ghotbi v GN either. It really isn't an argument for anyone interested in cold hard facts.
I actually had saw the first part of this video a while ago and I liked his fire. In retrospect, and although it may be unfair to judge, you can see how he may have applied the same tactics to TM - which against S.Korea really were misplaced.
Also, you're referring to Sina in the Obama example If I am correct. I too think he was too fervent, but it is the sign of an intelligent mind that one can rethink and reconsider their position...especially a position they were emotionally connected with.
Um, no. Ghotbi won 18 games in his season. GN won 19 games with Esteghlal in his 2nd title. GN also beat Ghotbi with 19 games won with Sepahan last season. He holds essentially every record worth holding:
GN has most goals scored in a season ever record.
GN has least goals conceded in a season ever record.
GN has most points gained in a season ever record.
GN has had the best goal difference in a season ever record.
GN is the only coach to have won 2 IPL titles record.
GN is the only coach to have won 3 IPL titles record.
GN is the only coach to win IPL titles with two different teams record.
What makes this even more remarkable is the two times he took over Esteghlal we were in dire straits, closer to the bottom than the top.
Mahdi jan, I am past caring about either of these coaches to let it descend into a 10 page argument, but the above are cold hard facts.
I agree, I don't want to argue Ghotbi v GN either. It really isn't an argument for anyone interested in cold hard facts.
I actually had saw the first part of this video a while ago and I liked his fire. In retrospect, and although it may be unfair to judge, you can see how he may have applied the same tactics to TM - which against S.Korea really were misplaced.
Also, you're referring to Sina in the Obama example If I am correct. I too think he was too fervent, but it is the sign of an intelligent mind that one can rethink and reconsider their position...especially a position they were emotionally connected with.
Um, no. Ghotbi won 18 games in his season. GN won 19 games with Esteghlal in his 2nd title. GN also beat Ghotbi with 19 games won with Sepahan last season. He holds essentially every record worth holding:
GN has most goals scored in a season ever record.
GN has least goals conceded in a season ever record.
GN has most points gained in a season ever record.
GN has had the best goal difference in a season ever record.
GN is the only coach to have won 2 IPL titles record.
GN is the only coach to have won 3 IPL titles record.
GN is the only coach to win IPL titles with two different teams record.
What makes this even more remarkable is the two times he took over Esteghlal we were in dire straits, closer to the bottom than the top.
Mahdi jan, I am past caring about either of these coaches to let it descend into a 10 page argument, but the above are cold hard facts.
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Bardia jan, the Australian A-League may be more organised than the IPL but comparing Sepahan and Esteghlal to Queensland Roar or Adelaide United would be a lil' funny. Let's get real. Let's get past bullshit point-scoring. Even if he took over Gamba or Kashima Antlers I'd say the same. It's one thing to get hired somewhere; it is another thing to win championships. The fact that people even have to point to this move to the J-League as some sort of plus shows the deficiency in arguing about his record as it stands.
Bebin i see it this way: Ghotbi bigger than GN by all footballing accounts. Period. The guy has gone the right way and worked himself up from US to East Asia. He cant be all that bad in terms of coaching and everything related to it.
GN is just a cocksucker. A hezi dayoos who -as mentioned a few months ago- i have seen what kind of a motherfucker is as he came to PAS Tehran club to tasvie hesaab with someone, it was like shaboon bimokh trying to make gardo khaak with the difference ke GN taa zire tokhme manam nist martikeye heyvoon. Nafasesh az jaaye garm boland mishe, mikhaad hamaro doro varesh khafe kone. Morabi garish taa hodoodi too systeme Ali Parvine, yani deymi, say mikone baa zer zer o mozakhrafaat o laat baazi bazikono behesh roohiye bede. Momkene ham javaab bede, chon oon bazikon too iran ham aakhe baazikone normal nist chon khodesham ye joonevare khoraafaatio mazhabiye khaasiye. Baa joono del donbaalesh radif mishan vaghti in dayoos bade bord vasate zamin parcheye sabz pahn mikone o shoroo mikone namaaz balghoor kardan.
Farghe beyne in do: GN az nazare fanni pashme Ghotbi ham nist o nemitoone baashe.
Shebaahate in do be ham: Khoorde shishe o kesaafat too vojoode jofteshoone montaahaa GN hamishe in jaakeshi ke hast bood o too oon lajanzaar kaar koshte shode. Ghotbi too amrikaa aadam shode bood, dorost pish rafte bood, baa omid oomad Iran o shoore hosseini gereftesh fekr kard iran o vatan tohfeiye, iraade kaaresh injaa bood: Vaghti motevajeh shod ke Iran ham pokhi nisto nemizaaran kaaresho bokone, age aadam bood, age vaase khodesh arzesh ghaael mibood, vel mikard miraft o nemizaasht be injaahaa bekeshe. Aslan Perspolisam baayad vel mikard miraft che berese be Team IR ro.
Kesaafat kaariye ghotbi oonjaai shoroo shod ke baa inke daroonan midoonest ke too iran hich chizi avaz besho nist, hich raahi baraaye morabigariye herfei vojood nadaare, oomad khodesho baa in mohite kesaafat tatbigh daad o moond o harchi inaa goftan goft chashm. Oomad khodesho kard aalate daste inaa, goftan biaa baa AN molaaghaat kon goft chashm, goftan biaa felaan harfo bezan goft chashm, goftan biaa besaar kaaro bokon goft chashm va natijasham in bood ke aaberooye khodesho bord. Aaberooye khodesh baayad vaasash mohemtar az in harfaa mibood chon Iran ke aaberooi nadaare ke bekhaad bere, harki ke miaad too in dastgaah shoroo mikone be kaar bade modate kootaahi mifahme ke injaa hich kaari ro nemishe dorost va mostaghel anjaam daad, bazikone irooni oon baazikone sar bezir va kooshaaye korei nist, irooni hich pokhi nist o fekr mikone esmesho ye trailer ham nemitoone bekeshe. Nabaayad too iran mimoond, baayad miraft ke naraft.
Dar har soorat, hameye zavaayaaye jaryaan ro dar nazar begiri, GN az nazare jaakeshi o heyvaan sefati aslan ghaabele moghaayese baa Ghotbi nist. GN 3 taa league baalaa tar baazi mikone.
GN is just a cocksucker. A hezi dayoos who -as mentioned a few months ago- i have seen what kind of a motherfucker is as he came to PAS Tehran club to tasvie hesaab with someone, it was like shaboon bimokh trying to make gardo khaak with the difference ke GN taa zire tokhme manam nist martikeye heyvoon. Nafasesh az jaaye garm boland mishe, mikhaad hamaro doro varesh khafe kone. Morabi garish taa hodoodi too systeme Ali Parvine, yani deymi, say mikone baa zer zer o mozakhrafaat o laat baazi bazikono behesh roohiye bede. Momkene ham javaab bede, chon oon bazikon too iran ham aakhe baazikone normal nist chon khodesham ye joonevare khoraafaatio mazhabiye khaasiye. Baa joono del donbaalesh radif mishan vaghti in dayoos bade bord vasate zamin parcheye sabz pahn mikone o shoroo mikone namaaz balghoor kardan.
Farghe beyne in do: GN az nazare fanni pashme Ghotbi ham nist o nemitoone baashe.
Shebaahate in do be ham: Khoorde shishe o kesaafat too vojoode jofteshoone montaahaa GN hamishe in jaakeshi ke hast bood o too oon lajanzaar kaar koshte shode. Ghotbi too amrikaa aadam shode bood, dorost pish rafte bood, baa omid oomad Iran o shoore hosseini gereftesh fekr kard iran o vatan tohfeiye, iraade kaaresh injaa bood: Vaghti motevajeh shod ke Iran ham pokhi nisto nemizaaran kaaresho bokone, age aadam bood, age vaase khodesh arzesh ghaael mibood, vel mikard miraft o nemizaasht be injaahaa bekeshe. Aslan Perspolisam baayad vel mikard miraft che berese be Team IR ro.
Kesaafat kaariye ghotbi oonjaai shoroo shod ke baa inke daroonan midoonest ke too iran hich chizi avaz besho nist, hich raahi baraaye morabigariye herfei vojood nadaare, oomad khodesho baa in mohite kesaafat tatbigh daad o moond o harchi inaa goftan goft chashm. Oomad khodesho kard aalate daste inaa, goftan biaa baa AN molaaghaat kon goft chashm, goftan biaa felaan harfo bezan goft chashm, goftan biaa besaar kaaro bokon goft chashm va natijasham in bood ke aaberooye khodesho bord. Aaberooye khodesh baayad vaasash mohemtar az in harfaa mibood chon Iran ke aaberooi nadaare ke bekhaad bere, harki ke miaad too in dastgaah shoroo mikone be kaar bade modate kootaahi mifahme ke injaa hich kaari ro nemishe dorost va mostaghel anjaam daad, bazikone irooni oon baazikone sar bezir va kooshaaye korei nist, irooni hich pokhi nist o fekr mikone esmesho ye trailer ham nemitoone bekeshe. Nabaayad too iran mimoond, baayad miraft ke naraft.
Dar har soorat, hameye zavaayaaye jaryaan ro dar nazar begiri, GN az nazare jaakeshi o heyvaan sefati aslan ghaabele moghaayese baa Ghotbi nist. GN 3 taa league baalaa tar baazi mikone.
I elaborated on my other post but I'll repost it here in case you missed it:
Even if he took over Gamba or Kashima Antlers I'd say the same. It's one thing to get hired somewhere; it is another thing to win championships. The fact that people even have to point to this move to the J-League as some sort of plus shows the deficiency in arguing about his record as it stands.
---
As for what you're arguing...who argued that the J-League isn't ahead of IPL? But is coaching Shimizu a better gig than coaching one of the giants in Asian football like Esteghlal? It isn't.
Shakhtar Donetsk may be in a crap league but it is a more privileged job than taking over Sunderland, which is in the EPL - which is far ahead of the Ukrainian league.
Even if he took over Gamba or Kashima Antlers I'd say the same. It's one thing to get hired somewhere; it is another thing to win championships. The fact that people even have to point to this move to the J-League as some sort of plus shows the deficiency in arguing about his record as it stands.
---
As for what you're arguing...who argued that the J-League isn't ahead of IPL? But is coaching Shimizu a better gig than coaching one of the giants in Asian football like Esteghlal? It isn't.
Shakhtar Donetsk may be in a crap league but it is a more privileged job than taking over Sunderland, which is in the EPL - which is far ahead of the Ukrainian league.
That's a nice fact; but a lot of their new generation plays abroad.
Ghotbi has promised them championships and glory. This is a team where for the last few years they have been mid-table peaking at around 4th spot around this last decade. His team isn't bad but I think the heavyweights of the league will have too much quality over the course of a season. If he does well, he'll prove his detractors wrong.
From what I have witnessed (and I have witnessed the entirety of his head-coach career) he isn't going to deliver and I wouldn't be surprised if he is removed before the season ends. It's one thing to shit on GN because you dislike him, but let's not start pretending his teams were Brazil circa 1970.
Ghotbi has promised them championships and glory. This is a team where for the last few years they have been mid-table peaking at around 4th spot around this last decade. His team isn't bad but I think the heavyweights of the league will have too much quality over the course of a season. If he does well, he'll prove his detractors wrong.
From what I have witnessed (and I have witnessed the entirety of his head-coach career) he isn't going to deliver and I wouldn't be surprised if he is removed before the season ends. It's one thing to shit on GN because you dislike him, but let's not start pretending his teams were Brazil circa 1970.
No problem. To clarify further: you also miscounted on the record points tally. Even had Perspolis got their 6 points back GN would still hold that record too. He pretty much holds every important record in existance. 1 record fine, 3 records fine...all the records? Let's give the man his dues for once. It's just not an argument that GN is better than Ghotbi (thus far).
Don't have time to read all 3 pages, but I'm sensing that there is a debate on if Ghom is better than kashoon .......
Advocates of GN : For every championship that GN brought to Taj, he screwed up couple of championship opportunities.....Ego, nabalad kari,....
Among the IPL coaches, having a claim on fame and mastery, he is probably moderately strong in arranging the team, but perhaps the worst bazi khaan as the game goes along, which is an indication of his lack of depth in classical analysis of football.
Relatively OK motivator
Ghotbi :
Do not discredit estili's role in the team that was handed to Ghotbi for that zooraki championship.The core of that team was also coached by denizly and haan shortly before.
He is a good motivator,and perhaps one of the best in recent years in iran in bazi khaani. He is weaker than GN in terms of preparing the team (physically) to start the game.
He is better than GN in grooming young talent. He is also much more civilized than GN,so less potential of ego issues,kesafat bazi, and conflicts with players.
In conclusion, na ghom khobe na kashoon. But I suspect Ghotbi has a better path for him to potentially excell. GN, has reached his cap.hamine ke hast.
Advocates of GN : For every championship that GN brought to Taj, he screwed up couple of championship opportunities.....Ego, nabalad kari,....
Among the IPL coaches, having a claim on fame and mastery, he is probably moderately strong in arranging the team, but perhaps the worst bazi khaan as the game goes along, which is an indication of his lack of depth in classical analysis of football.
Relatively OK motivator
Ghotbi :
Do not discredit estili's role in the team that was handed to Ghotbi for that zooraki championship.The core of that team was also coached by denizly and haan shortly before.
He is a good motivator,and perhaps one of the best in recent years in iran in bazi khaani. He is weaker than GN in terms of preparing the team (physically) to start the game.
He is better than GN in grooming young talent. He is also much more civilized than GN,so less potential of ego issues,kesafat bazi, and conflicts with players.
In conclusion, na ghom khobe na kashoon. But I suspect Ghotbi has a better path for him to potentially excell. GN, has reached his cap.hamine ke hast.
With all due respect biAzar jan 
; GN's won 3/7 years in the top flight - 2/4 for Esteghlal. One of those years were with Mes and only half a season as well. Two of those non-league winning years were his first ever 2 seasons in charge of a top flight club. It's often forgotten that GN is still a relatively new coach. That kind of league winning percentage is fantastic by any standard.
I disagree with some of the rest as well. GN is renown for his changes in 2nd half - making his team play better, as far az bazi-khani goes. Someone who has all these records can't be a so-so coach - with respect to the level of football he is competing in. I'd say his big weakness is succumbing to pressure. When it gets to the tail end of the season or in the ACL...he starts making dumb decisions and as the media gets on his back he seemingly starts to pass that pressure onto the players and it is visible often.
He does seem to have an unfailing belief in the players he picks. Borhani essentially cost us a chance to get into the knock-out stages in the ACL by missing a penalty and chance after chance. GN's response: I don't care if he misses many more; I believe in him. One may question that is why Borhani suddenly became aghaye gol under his reign and back to retardation once GN left.
As for the future...who knows. As of right now...it's pretty clear.
; GN's won 3/7 years in the top flight - 2/4 for Esteghlal. One of those years were with Mes and only half a season as well. Two of those non-league winning years were his first ever 2 seasons in charge of a top flight club. It's often forgotten that GN is still a relatively new coach. That kind of league winning percentage is fantastic by any standard.I disagree with some of the rest as well. GN is renown for his changes in 2nd half - making his team play better, as far az bazi-khani goes. Someone who has all these records can't be a so-so coach - with respect to the level of football he is competing in. I'd say his big weakness is succumbing to pressure. When it gets to the tail end of the season or in the ACL...he starts making dumb decisions and as the media gets on his back he seemingly starts to pass that pressure onto the players and it is visible often.
He does seem to have an unfailing belief in the players he picks. Borhani essentially cost us a chance to get into the knock-out stages in the ACL by missing a penalty and chance after chance. GN's response: I don't care if he misses many more; I believe in him. One may question that is why Borhani suddenly became aghaye gol under his reign and back to retardation once GN left.
As for the future...who knows. As of right now...it's pretty clear.
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I don't think even GN's son defends GN the way Kaz defends him!
But it pains me to say that GN's Esteghlal played much much better football than Ghotbi's Perspolis.
I will not compare results....because we really cant compare!
Ghotbi was only in charge of PP for 2 years. GN has been coaching clubs for almost 10 years now.
And we all know that this CANCER is well conencted to virtually every sector of society including VEZARAT ETTELAAT!!
I am only comparing the style of the 2 coaches...and well Ghotbi...he has none!
Ghotbi is a good showman...he could have had incredible success if he went on television, hosting events, etc.
he will be fired before half season from his new club.
And Mansour Ebrahimzadeh OWWNNSS both these assholes.
What he has achieved with Zobahan in the past 3-4 years far exceeds what GN, Ghotbi, Jalali or anyon else can even dream of accomplishing.
He is currently the best coach in Iran.
ps, the ONLY reason why few people still defend Ghotbi despite his horrible coaching and siding with AN, is because he coached perspolis...
If he coached Esteghlal, people like Houmanbahal would be shitting all over him from the get-go.
But it pains me to say that GN's Esteghlal played much much better football than Ghotbi's Perspolis.
I will not compare results....because we really cant compare!
Ghotbi was only in charge of PP for 2 years. GN has been coaching clubs for almost 10 years now.
And we all know that this CANCER is well conencted to virtually every sector of society including VEZARAT ETTELAAT!!
I am only comparing the style of the 2 coaches...and well Ghotbi...he has none!
Ghotbi is a good showman...he could have had incredible success if he went on television, hosting events, etc.
he will be fired before half season from his new club.
And Mansour Ebrahimzadeh OWWNNSS both these assholes.
What he has achieved with Zobahan in the past 3-4 years far exceeds what GN, Ghotbi, Jalali or anyon else can even dream of accomplishing.
He is currently the best coach in Iran.
ps, the ONLY reason why few people still defend Ghotbi despite his horrible coaching and siding with AN, is because he coached perspolis...
If he coached Esteghlal, people like Houmanbahal would be shitting all over him from the get-go.
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What he does outside of the pitch is mostly irrelevant for the large part, with regards to this discussion. You want to taint him...go ahead. Just remember to taint everybody else associated with our football. It's never been that I don't accept that he may have certain influence; it's just that it goes for essentially anybody who has a high place in our football. Which is the irony as people point to GN as if the likes of Kohan, Ghotbi, Daei and many others are better.
I've said it before and I'll say it again: you can't pick and choose. Either they're all dirty or none of them are.
Haha, you're Iranian...that shouldn't sound awkward at all.
I've said it before and I'll say it again: you can't pick and choose. Either they're all dirty or none of them are.
Haha, you're Iranian...that shouldn't sound awkward at all.
http://www.afshinghotbi.com/default.asp
سلام
همین اول اعلام میکنیم ما قصد هیچگونه بی احترامی به شخص یا اشخاص خاصی رو نداریم و فقط و فقط میخوایم این سایت رو تریبونی قرار بدیم برای اعلام اعتراض خودمون قرار دادیم!
مشکل اصلی و دلیل دل خوری ما ملت هکر عدم نتیجه گیری در جام ملت ها و عدم صعود به جام جهانی بود
دیگه دل ما رو شکوندی اسباب ناراحتی رو فراهم کردی تا ما این صفحه رو برای سایت شما طراحی کنیم
درضمن تمامی اطلاعات سایت دست نخورده و سالم هستن و ما فقط صفحه ی اصلی رو تغییر دادیم! امیدواریم ناراحت نشین از دست ما یه موقع!
در ابتدا در مورد تیم ژاپنی جدیدی که هدایت اون رو بر عهده گرفتید تبریک می گویم و امیدواریم هرجا که هستین پیروز و موفق باشید
باعث افتخار ما ایرانی ها است که شما یک سر مربی ایرانی در عرصه بین المللی فعالیت می کنید
بریم سر اصل مطلب
ما دیدیم جواب رسانه و گذارش گرهای ایرانی رو نمیدید دست رسی نداریم بهتون گفتیم مستقیم روی سایت شخصی خودتون از شما انتقاد و درد و دل کنیم
درسته شما زیاد مقصر این شکست اخیر نیستی و ..........
بریم سره سوالات
اول از همه چرا علی کریمی از اردو قهر کرد الان که ایران نیستی جواب بده حداقل
مال دنیا این همه ارزش داره از مالیات فرار می کنی درسته سره پول تیم ملی ما رو ببری تو حاشیه؟
http://up.iranblog.com/images/heap2ialc55uenrcb6em.jpg
کره جنوبی خدا وکیلی به غیر از این شما تاکتیک دیگه ای داشت تیم ما؟ برای بازی با
یه توصیه برادرانه
سعی کن جایی رو مثل کف دستت یاد نگیری انگار در دیدن نقاط نزدیک زیاد توانا نیستید
بعد از اون اتفاق تلخ و عدم صعود ایران به جام جهانی اینم از جام ملت های آسیا!
دلمون خوش بود که اینجا جام می گیریم که نشد با تدابیر شما
ما دل شیر رو دوست داریم ولی صبر ایوب نداریم وایسیم شما نتیجه بگیری از این به بعد فوتبال رو نتیجه گرا دنبال کن
به امید پیروزی و سر بلندی تیم ملی ایران در تمام عرصه های ملی
و دیدن روزی که فوتبال ما با برنامه پیش بره
B.V & H.Z Was Here!
Sp Tnx To NE...
سلام
همین اول اعلام میکنیم ما قصد هیچگونه بی احترامی به شخص یا اشخاص خاصی رو نداریم و فقط و فقط میخوایم این سایت رو تریبونی قرار بدیم برای اعلام اعتراض خودمون قرار دادیم!
مشکل اصلی و دلیل دل خوری ما ملت هکر عدم نتیجه گیری در جام ملت ها و عدم صعود به جام جهانی بود
دیگه دل ما رو شکوندی اسباب ناراحتی رو فراهم کردی تا ما این صفحه رو برای سایت شما طراحی کنیم
درضمن تمامی اطلاعات سایت دست نخورده و سالم هستن و ما فقط صفحه ی اصلی رو تغییر دادیم! امیدواریم ناراحت نشین از دست ما یه موقع!
در ابتدا در مورد تیم ژاپنی جدیدی که هدایت اون رو بر عهده گرفتید تبریک می گویم و امیدواریم هرجا که هستین پیروز و موفق باشید
باعث افتخار ما ایرانی ها است که شما یک سر مربی ایرانی در عرصه بین المللی فعالیت می کنید
بریم سر اصل مطلب
ما دیدیم جواب رسانه و گذارش گرهای ایرانی رو نمیدید دست رسی نداریم بهتون گفتیم مستقیم روی سایت شخصی خودتون از شما انتقاد و درد و دل کنیم
درسته شما زیاد مقصر این شکست اخیر نیستی و ..........
بریم سره سوالات
اول از همه چرا علی کریمی از اردو قهر کرد الان که ایران نیستی جواب بده حداقل
مال دنیا این همه ارزش داره از مالیات فرار می کنی درسته سره پول تیم ملی ما رو ببری تو حاشیه؟
http://up.iranblog.com/images/heap2ialc55uenrcb6em.jpg
کره جنوبی خدا وکیلی به غیر از این شما تاکتیک دیگه ای داشت تیم ما؟ برای بازی با
یه توصیه برادرانه
سعی کن جایی رو مثل کف دستت یاد نگیری انگار در دیدن نقاط نزدیک زیاد توانا نیستید
بعد از اون اتفاق تلخ و عدم صعود ایران به جام جهانی اینم از جام ملت های آسیا!
دلمون خوش بود که اینجا جام می گیریم که نشد با تدابیر شما
ما دل شیر رو دوست داریم ولی صبر ایوب نداریم وایسیم شما نتیجه بگیری از این به بعد فوتبال رو نتیجه گرا دنبال کن
به امید پیروزی و سر بلندی تیم ملی ایران در تمام عرصه های ملی
و دیدن روزی که فوتبال ما با برنامه پیش بره
B.V & H.Z Was Here!
Sp Tnx To NE...
