since no other country bought them the u.s easily phased it out and ordered the manufacturer to halt production of spare parts so iran would not be able to get its hand on them.
That's while F-5, F-4 from a previous generation are still in use in countries like turkey or even the U.S for training purposes.
My objection was not say the F-14 was bad plane from a technical perspective.
but from cost benefit analysis point of view. since it was an air superiority plane we were mostly able to use them protect iran's refinary and oil terminals.
That is while our F-4 and F5 Squadrons were heavily used during the war for handful of major operations.
in an ideal you want to throw money at everything. but with limited resources you have to select your poison with care
That's while F-5, F-4 from a previous generation are still in use in countries like turkey or even the U.S for training purposes.
My objection was not say the F-14 was bad plane from a technical perspective.
but from cost benefit analysis point of view. since it was an air superiority plane we were mostly able to use them protect iran's refinary and oil terminals.
That is while our F-4 and F5 Squadrons were heavily used during the war for handful of major operations.
in an ideal you want to throw money at everything. but with limited resources you have to select your poison with care
We studied the F14 and it's history in the Navy, it is simply amazing it had such a long run. To think the mighty F14 had a two decade plus two year run is simply amazing! Here are some fun facts for you about 1974. In the year 1974 one gallon of gas cost just .55 cent.
Events that happened in 1974
K
IRA begins bombing campaign on mainland Britainand bombs The Tower of London on July 17th and the Houses of parliament and pubs in Birmingham
U.S.
Following impeachment hearings started on May 9th Richard Nixonbecomes the first US president forced to resign after the Watergate Scandal
U.S.
President Gerald Ford gives unconditional pardon to Richard Nixon
U.S.
A major US Bank Franklin National Bank is declared insolvent
U.S.
55 MPH Speed Limit imposed to preserve gas usage US wide
Australia
The Brisbane river floods large areas of the Brisbane business district and more than 8,500 homes were flooded in Brisbane and Ipswich.
World
Worldwide Inflationhelps to cause dramatic increases in the cost of fuel, food and manufacturing
U.S.
Sears Tower in Chicago becomes the worlds tallest building
U.S.
President Ford announces an amnesty program for Vietnam War deserters and draft evaders
Events that happened in 1974
K
IRA begins bombing campaign on mainland Britainand bombs The Tower of London on July 17th and the Houses of parliament and pubs in Birmingham
U.S.
Following impeachment hearings started on May 9th Richard Nixonbecomes the first US president forced to resign after the Watergate Scandal
U.S.
President Gerald Ford gives unconditional pardon to Richard Nixon
U.S.
A major US Bank Franklin National Bank is declared insolvent
U.S.
55 MPH Speed Limit imposed to preserve gas usage US wide
Australia
The Brisbane river floods large areas of the Brisbane business district and more than 8,500 homes were flooded in Brisbane and Ipswich.
World
Worldwide Inflationhelps to cause dramatic increases in the cost of fuel, food and manufacturing
U.S.
Sears Tower in Chicago becomes the worlds tallest building
U.S.
President Ford announces an amnesty program for Vietnam War deserters and draft evaders
Iran's airforce is obsolite. F4,F5 and even F-14 with its current state is not a match to other persian gulf airforces. Plus the battle in the air is won by the pilot training. Iranian pilot lack that at the present time. Iran's Navy is the same. Only Iran's missile system is something of concern to the west...
Comic publisher? he interviewed pilots who flew the f-14 in the the tomcats whom all agree and say it was exactly what iran needed. I suggest you read his actuall book before talking out of rear end.The eagles radar could not help what iran needed according to actuall test pilots who flew it and all agreed in a conclusive fashion that the F-14 with it's weapons envelope and AWG-9 radar which had the ability to track and target bandits be it at 500 feet or 73,000 thousand feet something the Eagle could not do and did not have any missiles to do that unlike the AIM-54 of the Tomcat was exactly what we needed infact the AIM-7( radar guided sparrow) and AIM-9P(infera red) short to medium range missiles had more range and accuacey when fired from the Tomcats AWG-9 radar then the Eagles radar .. Ths meant that the tomcats fire and control system with it's far superior range and accuracey gave the pilot a better chance in both the beyond visual range and close combat merge theatre of combat. The tomcats radar which could easily perform as an airborne ealy warning system and had an weapons envelope that the eagle could dream of.The tomcat was a strategic defensive platform which could pickoff fighters from well over a 100 KM's and spot an enemy at well beyond visual range was a key asset/platform that saved khark island from one day of stopped production which could have crippled iran.As one of the earliest F-14 pilots who flew both of the tomcat and the eagle said, you would have to be a tottal idiot to think Shah selected the Tomcats for anything other then capability after this pilot personally gave the shah his briefing on both those platforms and pluses and negatives
.Shah sent 6 different test pilots who were all the best of the best of the IIAF fliers and even they all agreed the Tomcat with it's far superior weapons envelope and radar, fire control system combined with it's variable wings which gave the pilots to change the wings angles in different angles of attack and gave the tomcat superior turning capeability and a much better tighter turn radius then the eagle. The IIAF tomcats actually defeated the USAF eagles in many different aircombat simulation dogfights just because of that and they picked the eagles off and well beyond visual range. Later on these tomcats would out turn the much nimbler Mig-21's in combat and eat the French F-EQ' for breakfast.
Infact from 1969 Shah was trying to get an established fighter with a long range radar to combat Irans challenging terrain which did not allow for an integrated radar system and had General Mehdi Rouhani and Iraj ghaffari to look at this. There was no mention of this guy by any of the pilots interviewd. it seems this gentleman like you'reself who claims about you're dady being in shah's inner circle which is almost farsical and had first hand information(which even he prime minster wasn't that close to the shah) has g one on a pro mollahs anti shah documentary and spewed to vent and make himself feel specia and offcourse as usuall you are running with it as you're inside source.Tom cooper has more know how regarding aviation in his little finger then you have in you're entire body.
.Shah sent 6 different test pilots who were all the best of the best of the IIAF fliers and even they all agreed the Tomcat with it's far superior weapons envelope and radar, fire control system combined with it's variable wings which gave the pilots to change the wings angles in different angles of attack and gave the tomcat superior turning capeability and a much better tighter turn radius then the eagle. The IIAF tomcats actually defeated the USAF eagles in many different aircombat simulation dogfights just because of that and they picked the eagles off and well beyond visual range. Later on these tomcats would out turn the much nimbler Mig-21's in combat and eat the French F-EQ' for breakfast.
Infact from 1969 Shah was trying to get an established fighter with a long range radar to combat Irans challenging terrain which did not allow for an integrated radar system and had General Mehdi Rouhani and Iraj ghaffari to look at this. There was no mention of this guy by any of the pilots interviewd. it seems this gentleman like you'reself who claims about you're dady being in shah's inner circle which is almost farsical and had first hand information(which even he prime minster wasn't that close to the shah) has g one on a pro mollahs anti shah documentary and spewed to vent and make himself feel specia and offcourse as usuall you are running with it as you're inside source.Tom cooper has more know how regarding aviation in his little finger then you have in you're entire body.
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I did not want to open up a separate thread so i post it here. I am a fan of jet fighters and specially Sukhoi. Sergei Bogdan is in my opinion the most skilled and talented pilot that i have ever seen and i have seen a lot of pilots flying all kinds of fighterjets. This is one of the best maneuver shows i have seen in my life. Sergei Bogdan and Sukhoi 35. Its amazing how this guy controlls 20 tons of steel in the air and all that in high speed. I have greatest respect for these pilots. A dog fight against such a pilot equiped with such a deadly weapon like sukhoi 35 would most probably end up in disaster.
[video=youtube;yVlmoNtcyhY]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yVlmoNtcyhY[/video]
[video=youtube;yVlmoNtcyhY]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yVlmoNtcyhY[/video]
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I am a huge Sukhoi 27 fan and the Russian knights(there blue angles version). It's ability to bring it's nose up at well over 75 degree for well over 3 to 4 seconds and ability to lock on a target is incredible. The Sukhoi 27 is a very well versed fighter. It has a great radar/weapons envelope with a very powerfull range and weapons envelope but in a merge and a dogfight it is where it shines like most Russian fighters namely the Mig-29 Fulcum and especially the newer SMT version.As you would know the Russians developed their fighters like the Mig-15 and the 21 for dogfights with with the arrowed wing and airfoils but by the time Sukhoi 27 came they developed a fighter with beyond visual range/avionics and great dogfight capability in a merge and it did not bleed energy like other fighters in i's size and generation which meant it had better capability in turns and tighter high velocity angles of attack..The newer Sukhoi 34 is obviously a much better upgrade with the newer version of the R-73 air to air missile and a avionics system and a world class avionics. Another invention was the thrust vectoring the Russians created and especially on the Fulcrum SMT which is a beast ith a modified RD-33 engine which has a 2 to 1 thrust to weight ratio.
The IRIAF super agile F-5E's in dogfight simulation were struggling with the Fulcrums regulary because once the Fulcrum increased it's thrust into zone 5 after burners and went into a vertical climb, it had the ability to pitch it's nose up at well over 40 dgrees without stalling for a sustained period on the Tiger II's 6 olock and lock and fire and take it out.Usually most other fighters would start going into stall at that point only our Tomcats were a match for it.With a trained experienced pilot with the right temperament the newer fulcum(SMT) or the newer Sukhoi 34 and the PAKF-50 can combat anything the west has not named the Raptor. The Raptor despite consistent oxygen regulator problems and had a crash, it is still in another level.
The IRIAF super agile F-5E's in dogfight simulation were struggling with the Fulcrums regulary because once the Fulcrum increased it's thrust into zone 5 after burners and went into a vertical climb, it had the ability to pitch it's nose up at well over 40 dgrees without stalling for a sustained period on the Tiger II's 6 olock and lock and fire and take it out.Usually most other fighters would start going into stall at that point only our Tomcats were a match for it.With a trained experienced pilot with the right temperament the newer fulcum(SMT) or the newer Sukhoi 34 and the PAKF-50 can combat anything the west has not named the Raptor. The Raptor despite consistent oxygen regulator problems and had a crash, it is still in another level.
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Really, you only need to go and read the history of dog fights to see what fine, skillful and excellent pilots the russians have always been. Far superiour to americans as example.The viet com Migs were giving the USAF and the US navy Phantoms and the Skyhawks a lot of grief.Mostly because of it's agility and speed and soviet decoy tactics. Where one fighter would work as a decoy and allow the US fighter to position it's nose on it's tail, but out of nowhere a second mig would comeout of nowhere and takes the occupied us fighter right from it's 6 oclock. this was a very effective soviet tactic developed in war war 2 and passed on o following combat theaters.
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The Phantoms be it the 2 seater version D or the one seater E's are still usefull to be used as strike platforms. Iran has upgraded it's fire and control systems to carry C-801 and C-802 anti ship missiles or the newer Iranian anti radar or radation missiles. They can carry the Mavericks or the Iranian version zoobin.They don't need to be sophisticated because their job is to attack targets be it short or medium range interdictions.Our Sukhoi 24's are used for hitting key targets or longer range interdictions.
Just like the Raptors it's heat radiation is almost minimal and radar signature is the same .What we don't know the classified information like it's weapons envelope, radar and electronic counter measures capabelities and how it may combat when it becomes exposed because once the weapons bay doors open to use it's air to air missiles, it radaiates heat and it will be picked off or starts beaming on the enemies radar and can be painted by the enemy by it's infera red system.That is when electronic counter and fighters dogfighting and weapons envelope kicks in.I feel it can combat anything the west had outside of the Raptor which is a monster.
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Its not just a feeling. F-22 and PAK FA are the best two fighters of our times and the differences between these two are really marginal. Yeah F-22 is a monster, it is exceptionally maneuverable, but comparatively less dogfight optimized compared to the PAK-FA which has 3D thrust vectoring and moving LERX.
Thrust vectoring has advantages and disadvatages as well.For thrust vectoring to be effective the pilot has to be the one on the offensive and attacking because if you use it as a defensive basic fighting manuver, it means you lose a lot of energy and against an enemy like the raptor which it's main advantage is the ability to conserve energy in high velocity manuvers will just perform a high tight turn radius turn and place it's nose on you're rear end. Thrust vectoring means you are using a lot of fuel and energy(creating drag) and in low altitude where the air is more dense will allow the raptor pilot to regain the pole position in a dogfight even with the moving leading edges on the F-50. I think it will come down who gets the first look . Usually the American fighters have the better radars and the Russians the better infera red system. The Sukhoi 35 officially has the longest infera system in the world with a 47 miles range.It will come down who gets the first opportunity to use his weapons in the others flight path and optimum range.
What I think the Russians do well is the helmeted mounted cueing and weapons systems the pilots have at their disposal.. some of them have over 90 degrees off boresight . The Irianian fulcrum Pilots had the basic version with a 60 offboresight and they loved it.This is very good thing to have in a within visual dogfight.
What I think the Russians do well is the helmeted mounted cueing and weapons systems the pilots have at their disposal.. some of them have over 90 degrees off boresight . The Irianian fulcrum Pilots had the basic version with a 60 offboresight and they loved it.This is very good thing to have in a within visual dogfight.
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But we both love a nice dogfight and we both know how skilled the russians are in dogfighting due to their traditional education that requires them to rely more on their skills and intuition. Americans rely a tad to much on technology than on personal skill which is a disadvantage in a dogfight. IN a dogfight that 3D thrust vecturing and moving LERX is an advantage.