do you give the right to israili soldiers for that action??YES OR NO

[The_Referee]

Chinaski

داداش ظرفیت نداری بحث نکن و بیشتر از این خودت رو ضایع نکن.
حالا میدونم که برمیگردی به من هم دری وری میگی ولی یه کمی چشماتو باز کنی میبینی که هر روز با یکی درگیری
برو یک کمی به خودت استراحت بده آب خنکی بخور دوسه روز دیگه بیا. به هر چیزی که اعتقاد داری یا نداری و به جون خودت داری خودت رو ضایع میکنی. باور نمیکنی ادامه بده همینطور
​

​

 

[khodam]

To be eligible for naturalization, a person must have resided in Israel for three years out of the previous five years. In addition, the applicant must have a right to reside in Israel on a permanent basis. All naturalization requests are, however, at the discretion of the Minister of the Interior.

Oh boy!! I thought you're just stubborn but the problem seems to be at a much more fundamental level.

As stated in your link, in order to naturalize you have reside in Israel for a number of years. But you can't really move to Israel to reside there if you're not Jewish. kapish?

 

[shahinc]

This is a joint effort but I am not sure if Israel have soldiers on the ground. It is more from the air or something, unless I am mistaken. However, without Egyptian cooperation it is impossible to control the influx of goods from Egypt to Gaza. Even with help of Egyptians the goods still cross the border but in a minimal amount.

It seems like it was last in control of Egypt and Hammas :

From Wikki :

"On February 3, 2008, Gaza's Foreign minister, Mahmoud al-Zahar, announced that Hamas and Egypt would cooperate in controlling the border without Israeli oversight.[8] The border was closed, after 11 days, except for travelers returning home.[9]"

Which really raises the question why the humanitarians are not using this crossing with cooperation from Egypt ?

And Also if Egypt is not cooperating, then why there is not a International outrage directed at them ?

By the way Wikipedia is the most reliable source of information, in my opinion. There are a lot of people from each side able to edit it and also many neutral admins are at work whereas government funded information system has been always one sided, based on bias of people involved or the funds. But Wikipedia has been a revolutionary source, believe me. It might not be of our liking sometimes because we too have been educated in most biased systems either way.

I know alot of people use it and I think It is great starting point but by no means meet my level of standards as a source of information.


Now, another question:

Since the Naval blockage of Gaza by Israel, Has there been any Humanitarian Ships that were allowed to deliver their cargo to Gaza ? Does anyone have any information on this ?

 

[khodam]

Chinaski

به هر چیزی که اعتقاد داری یا نداری و به جون خودت داری خودت رو ضایع میکنی. باور نمیکنی ادامه بده همینطور
​

​

ROFLMAO!!!!

:2v1:

 

[feyenoord]

Chinaski

داداش ظرفیت نداری بحث نکن و بیشتر از این خودت رو ضایع نکن.
حالا میدونم که برمیگردی به من هم دری وری میگی ولی یه کمی چشماتو باز کنی میبینی که هر روز با یکی درگیری
برو یک کمی به خودت استراحت بده آب خنکی بخور دوسه روز دیگه بیا. به هر چیزی که اعتقاد داری یا نداری و به جون خودت داری خودت رو ضایع میکنی. باور نمیکنی ادامه بده همینطور
​

LOOOOL

 

[Chinaski]

Oh boy!! I thought you're just stubborn but the problem seems to be at a much more fundamental level.

As stated in your link, in order to naturalize you have reside in Israel for a number of years. But you can't really move to Israel to reside there if you're not Jewish. kapish?

Na pessar jaan, you are talking nonsense again. Just in order to keep your face you are now piling up even more BS to support your previews BS. You are essentially saying nobody is allowed to reside in Israel without being jewish. Aakhe mozakhraf az in aashekaar tar? There are so many people living on limited visa just like in europe and america, they just work or study there and after a while they are allowed to apply for the israeli citizenship. Ye chize be in saadegi ro to nemifahmi. If they everybody had to be jewish to apply for the citizenship so whats the use of a law explaining the right to become a citizen through "Naturalization". A jew doesnt need to get naturalized IQ eep:

 

[feyenoord]

Na pessar jaan, you are talking nonsense again. Just in order to keep your face you are now piling up even more BS to support your previews BS. You are essentially saying nobody is allowed to reside in Israel without being jewish. Aakhe mozakhraf az in aashekaar tar? There are so many people living on limited visa just like in europe and america, they just work or study there and after a while they are allowed to apply for the israeli citizenship. Ye chize be in saadegi ro to nemifahmi. If they everybody had to be jewish to apply for the citizenship so whats the use of a law explaining the right to become a citizen through "Naturalization". A jew doesnt need to get naturalized IQ eep:

That is not what he meant! do not try to go around the argument! It is so easy to understand. People are not dumb here.

 

[shahinc]

You are essentially saying nobody is allowed to reside in Israel without being jewish. Aakhe mozakhraf az in aashekaar tar? There are so many people living on limited visa just like in europe and america, they just work or study there and after a while they are allowed to apply for the israeli citizenship.

I am not sure what you guys are discussing here but as far as above question goes:

I am not sure about applying for citizenship, but I know many people who are not Jews and are living in Israeil for over 20 years, working, going to school and ...
I also know many people, non-Jews, who were in Isreail on working visas and have worked there for few years and now are back in Canada and US.

All of them Iranian as well.

 

[Chinaski]

Chinaski

داداش ظرفیت نداری بحث نکن و بیشتر از این خودت رو ضایع نکن.
حالا میدونم که برمیگردی به من هم دری وری میگی ولی یه کمی چشماتو باز کنی میبینی که هر روز با یکی درگیری
برو یک کمی به خودت استراحت بده آب خنکی بخور دوسه روز دیگه بیا. به هر چیزی که اعتقاد داری یا نداری و به جون خودت داری خودت رو ضایع میکنی. باور نمیکنی ادامه بده همینطور
​

​

Inam sokhani az maadare aroos. vaalaa khodet dari vari ro shoroo mikoni, bad migi midooni ke behet dari vari khaaham goft! Be in chi migan? Paranoid? Sadist? Masochist?

Khob arab, age doost daari kessi behet dari vari nage, mage majboori khodet dari vari begi? Man aslan nemidoonam to sare piaazi? tashi? mogheyate ejtemaait chiye? aslan mogheyati daari?... man yaadam nemiyaad dar in mored aslan baa to bahsi karde baasham. Haalaa fekr mikoni baayad beshi asaaye daste oon refighet ke az aval taa akhare harfesh birabte? Khiaali nist, besho, montaahaa behet gofte baasham, kharbozeh mikhori, paa larzesham bishin. Haalaa ham boro bezaa baad biaad eep:

 

[khodam]

Na pessar jaan, you are talking nonsense again. Just in order to keep your face you are now piling up even more BS to support your previews BS. You are essentially saying nobody is allowed to reside in Israel without being jewish. Aakhe mozakhraf az in aashekaar tar? There are so many people living on limited visa just like in europe and america, they just work or study there and after a while they are allowed to apply for the israeli citizenship. Ye chize be in saadegi ro to nemifahmi. If they everybody had to be jewish to apply for the citizenship so whats the use of a law explaining the right to become a citizen through "Naturalization". A jew doesnt need to get naturalized IQ eep:

Hey, I can feel in your tone that you're giving the possibility that you might, just might be wrong for once, some consideration. Way to go man! That's a step. Good job.

Residing in a country, for the purpose of immigration, usually means that you live in the country after you move there as an immigrant. So if you study or live in a country you're not residing there from an immigration/naturalization point of view. Some countries have provisions for exemptions to this general rule such that some of your time on student or work visa could count toward your residency towards citizenship but that's not always the case (e.g. Canada does that but US doesn't).

And I'm not saying nobody is allowed to reside in Israel without being Jewish. I'm saying nobody is allowed to reside as an immigrant in Israel without being Jewish.

 

[khodam]

I am not sure what you guys are discussing here but as far as above question goes:

I am not sure about applying for citizenship, but I know many people who are not Jews and are living in Israeil for over 20 years, working, going to school and ...
I also know many people, non-Jews, who were in Isreail on working visas and have worked there for few years and now are back in Canada and US.

All of them Iranian as well.

That is correct. I also know non-Jewish folks (iranian and non-Iranian) that have lived in Israel. What I'm saying is that generally speaking (barring special cases like marriage) you can't immigrate to Israel if you're not Jewish.

 

[The_Referee]

Shahin Jaan,
I am not sure why are you trying really hard to blame the whole thing on activists and playing no devil advocate on Israeli part?

Which really raises the question why the humanitarians are not using this crossing with cooperation from Egypt ?

Isn't that obvious?

Egyptians were cooperating and basically carrying orders of their friends to ensure the blockade works, even against their own people's wishes.
So if you are an activist, would you go for the boss to let him cross the border or you engage in a complicated situation like land border?
If the big boss says yes, that means yes and if he says no. That means NO!

And Also if Egypt is not cooperating, then why there is not a International outrage directed at them ?

Because just two days ago 9 people are killed. That is, I think, more important than a friend not keeping his promise to another friend.
Also, I am not sure about the fine prints of the agreement. Maybe the agreement is not a permanent promise.

Now, another question:

Since the Naval blockage of Gaza by Israel, Has there been any Humanitarian Ships that were allowed to deliver their cargo to Gaza ? Does anyone have any information on this ?

There have been some. But you know how Israelis are. They have been really tough on this and they basically holding a whole nation hostage because one of their soldiers is hostage. That is also pathetic.

I am not saying Israel should not have defended herself, despite my opposition to their apartheid constitution. All I am saying is they are going to come with a lot of excuses. You, here, sound like someone trying to dig out anything to cover for the fact that 9 people died, no matter how aggressive they were. They were not convicted criminals or members of Taliban. Many of those on board were from Western countries. Maybe passionate like Greenies but in no way even comparable to terrorists.

Again, I am really dumbfounded, Shahin Jaan, by seeing you a peaceful person, a follower of a very liberal way of life, holding such a grudge against friends of your enemy to the extent that you are trying so hard to defend ANY Israeli action here! Sorry that I am blunt. But even if you are not doing it, it looks like you do.

 

[The_Referee]

I am not sure what you guys are discussing here but as far as above question goes:

I am not sure about applying for citizenship, but I know many people who are not Jews and are living in Israeil for over 20 years, working, going to school and ...
I also know many people, non-Jews, who were in Isreail on working visas and have worked there for few years and now are back in Canada and US.

All of them Iranian as well.

Any of them Muslim?
Maybe Israelis have some by-law for Bahais because their main temple is there. Or perhaps those Iranians have connection to the founder of Bahai religion who is buried there?

 

[The_Referee]

Inam sokhani az maadare aroos. vaalaa khodet dari vari ro shoroo mikoni, bad migi midooni ke behet dari vari khaaham goft! Be in chi migan? Paranoid? Sadist? Masochist?

Khob arab, age doost daari kessi behet dari vari nage, mage majboori khodet dari vari begi? Man aslan nemidoonam to sare piaazi? tashi? mogheyate ejtemaait chiye? aslan mogheyati daari?... man yaadam nemiyaad dar in mored aslan baa to bahsi karde baasham. Haalaa fekr mikoni baayad beshi asaaye daste oon refighet ke az aval taa akhare harfesh birabte? Khiaali nist, besho, montaahaa behet gofte baasham, kharbozeh mikhori, paa larzesham bishin. Haalaa ham boro bezaa baad biaad eep:

نگفتم؟
باشه بابا - شما علامه دهری و هرچی میگی درسته و عالیه و کارت درسته واقعا حرفات عالیه اصلا هرکی مخالف تواه اخه و بلد نیست بحث کنه وحرفها وپستهات باید با طلا نوشته بشه.
خوب شد آقای علامه دهر؟

حالا بذار ما کهتران با هم سر اصل مطلب تبادل نظر کنیم و حرف بی ربط بزنیم و بی منطق باشیم
شما لیاقتت بالاتر از این حرفهاست عالیجناب برو همتاهای خودت را پیدا کن و با آنها بحث کن
و وقتت رو اینجا تلف نکن

راضی شدی؟

​

 

[Chinaski]

Hey, I can feel in your tone that you're giving the possibility that you might, just might be wrong for once, some consideration. Way to go man! That's a step. Good job.

Residing in a country, for the purpose of immigration, usually means that you live in the country after you move there as an immigrant. So if you study or live in a country you're not residing there from an immigration/naturalization point of view. Some countries have provisions for exemptions to this general rule such that some of your time on student or work visa could count toward your residency towards citizenship but that's not always the case (e.g. Canada does that but US doesn't).

And I'm not saying nobody is allowed to reside in Israel without being Jewish. I'm saying nobody is allowed to reside as an immigrant in Israel without being Jewish.

Daare harfaat khande daar tar mishe. Hey daari donbaale ye raahi migardi oon mozakhrafeto azash defaa koni chon age nakoni baayad ghabool koni ke hame harfaat az aval taa aakharesh 2 zaaram nemiarzid lol

And I'm not saying nobody is allowed to reside in Israel without being Jewish. I'm saying nobody is allowed to reside as an immigrant in Israel without being

hehe...this is just fantastic. Keep the BS coming son. eep:

Enghad behet migam taa befahmi: There are 4 ways to get the israeli citizenship

# Birth
# The Law of Return
# Residence
# Naturalization


Taa injaasho gerefti? lol

oon 3 taaye avali ro vel kon bechasb be Naturalization. Kalamaro befahm, farghesh ro baa oon 3 noghteye dige befahm oonvaght khodet khaahi fahmid ke az aval taa aakhare harfet birabt boode.

http://www.mfa.gov.il/MFA/MFAArchive/2000_2009/2001/8/Acquisition of Israeli Nationality


Aakhe ooni ke mire mikhaad az tarighe Naturalization esraaili she, age joohood bood ke aslan laazem nabood naturalized beshe ke. Cheraa enghad harfe moft mizani to aakhe?

 

[Chinaski]

نگفتم؟
باشه بابا - شما علامه دهری و هرچی میگی درسته و عالیه و کارت درسته واقعا حرفات عالیه اصلا هرکی مخالف تواه اخه و بلد نیست بحث کنه وحرفها وپستهات باید با طلا نوشته بشه.
خوب شد آقای علامه دهر؟

حالا بذار ما کهتران با هم سر اصل مطلب تبادل نظر کنیم و حرف بی ربط بزنیم و بی منطق باشیم
شما لیاقتت بالاتر از این حرفهاست عالیجناب برو همتاهای خودت را پیدا کن و با آنها بحث کن
و وقتت رو اینجا تلف نکن

راضی شدی؟

​

Raazi shodam? Az chi? Vaalaa man ke az avalesham raazi boodam chon to too in bahs aslan faktori naboodi, Baa to aslan harfi nadaashtam ke yeho khodeto ghaati kardi oonam bijaa o birabt, aslan na dar morede jaryaan harf zadi na hichi faghat ye cherto perti neveshti gofti "khodeto zaaye" nakon! alaan ham dar kamaale por rooi, daari dobaare charand baare man mikoni dar soorati ke man hanooz moondam ke man key hizome tari be to forookhtam ke oomadi khodet khodeto bezoor kardi tarafe harfe man, haalaa ham khodet daari rolle moosh mordaro baazi mikoni. Haalaa cheraa to inkaaro mikoni, az man napors, man nemidoonam.
Jeddi migam refigh, man too in moondam ke to in vasat aslan chi mikhaay! Age mikhaay dar morede jaryaan bahs koni, khob, bokon, montaahaa man oon poste avali ke vaase man neveshtiro nemifahmam chon kheyli birabt bood be jaryaane bahsam kaari nadaasht.

 

[shahinc]

Any of them Muslim?
Maybe Israelis have some by-law for Bahais because their main temple is there. Or perhaps those Iranians have connection to the founder of Bahai religion who is buried there?

Nope, Some of them are actually muslims and has nothing to do with Bahai.

 

[Chinaski]

From official site of Israeli ministry of foreign affairs:
http://www.mfa.gov.il/MFA/MFAArchive/2000_2009/2001/8/Acquisition of Israeli Nationality

Acquisition of Nationality by Naturalization

Adults may acquire Israeli citizenship by naturalization at the discretion of the Minister of the Interior and subject to a number of requirements, such as:
# they must have resided in Israel for three years out of five years preceding the day of submission of the application;

# they are entitled to reside in Israel permanently and have settled or intended to settle in Israel;

# they have renounced their prior nationality, or have proved that they will cease to be foreign nationals upon becoming Israeli citizens.

The Minister of the Interior may exempt an applicant from some of these requirements.

 

[khodam]

# Birth
# The Law of Return
# Residence
# Naturalization

Nope, you are a lost cause. Baba for Naturalization you need to reside a period of few years in Israel under a certain category, i.e., as an immigrant. Workers and students (not sure about students, but most probably the case) generally cannot become citizens unless they apply for immigration. If you're a Jew (by the way, not Joohood; the correct term is Yahoodi!) you're automatically entitled to citizenship. Naturalization is usually for special cases where there is some sort of a link to Judaism like parents of an Israeli citizen or marriage with an Israeli. You can't just go to your local Israeli consulate and apply for immigration to Israel if you're not a Jew. I mean you can, but you'll never get it.

The following has lots of information but it's long:

http://www.migrationinformation.org/Feature/display.cfm?ID=321

Relevant pieces:

In 90s and early 2000s many non-Jew workers were allowed as part of temporary migrant worker program into Israel to replace palestinian work force. Out of about half a million only few thousands were from Turkey and Lebanon. No other muslim country. Almost no muslims. As the article mentions:

"The temporary work visas are usually for a period of five years and three months (and in the case of home health-care workers even longer, under certain circumstances) and are only valid if the holder continues to work for the original employer. Migrant worker permits must be renewed annually. Work visas almost never lead to citizenship, even if the worker marries an Israeli citizen."

 

[The_Referee]

Raazi shodam? Az chi? Vaalaa man ke az avalesham raazi boodam chon to too in bahs aslan faktori naboodi, Baa to aslan harfi nadaashtam ke yeho khodeto ghaati kardi oonam bijaa o birabt, aslan na dar morede jaryaan harf zadi na hichi faghat ye cherto perti neveshti gofti "khodeto zaaye" nakon! alaan ham dar kamaale por rooi, daari dobaare charand baare man mikoni dar soorati ke man hanooz moondam ke man key hizome tari be to forookhtam ke oomadi khodet khodeto bezoor kardi tarafe harfe man, haalaa ham khodet daari rolle moosh mordaro baazi mikoni. Haalaa cheraa to inkaaro mikoni, az man napors, man nemidoonam.
Jeddi migam refigh, man too in moondam ke to in vasat aslan chi mikhaay! Age mikhaay dar morede jaryaan bahs koni, khob, bokon, montaahaa man oon poste avali ke vaase man neveshtiro nemifahmam chon kheyli birabt bood be jaryaane bahsam kaari nadaasht.

- اصلا شما خودت رو ضایع نمیکردی و داشتی خوب بحث میکردی. یعنی میدونی این خودم بود که داشت خودش رو ضایع میکرد با جدی گرفتن جوابهای تو و سعی در منطقی جواب دادن به تو - تو که نعوذ بالله اصلا خطا مطا نمیکنی و حرف غلط و بیجا نمیزنی

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